1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:29,980 Thank you for listening. 2 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:34,280 Hey everybody, welcome to a special episode of Edge of Wonder. 3 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:36,680 A very special episode of Edge of Wonder. 4 00:00:36,820 --> 00:00:46,000 Where we actually have a full-on mason with us who's decided to sit with us and obviously, you know... 5 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:47,760 Tell us the secrets. 6 00:00:47,900 --> 00:00:52,340 Tell us the secrets, but also kind of hide his identity because they watch everything. 7 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:54,100 I mean, we all know that. 8 00:00:54,100 --> 00:00:55,740 So we spent... 9 00:00:55,740 --> 00:00:59,260 This is somebody that we've been in contact with for a very long time. 10 00:00:59,260 --> 00:01:00,240 Yeah, not an alien. 11 00:01:00,420 --> 00:01:01,000 Not an alien. 12 00:01:01,140 --> 00:01:02,400 Not that kind of contact. 13 00:01:02,780 --> 00:01:02,940 Right. 14 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,860 And so this has been a couple years in the making, really. 15 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:09,580 So we've really got to know this person really well. 16 00:01:10,420 --> 00:01:13,720 Everything that he's told us has checked out over time. 17 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:20,100 And he's finally agreed to come on camera, but like you said, as like a secret identity. 18 00:01:20,100 --> 00:01:26,220 Yeah, we're going to be hiding his face and voice and, you know, we're going to... 19 00:01:26,220 --> 00:01:31,140 For the purpose of this interview, we're going to call him Joaquin because we're cheesy. 20 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:32,900 You know, Joaquin and Boaz. 21 00:01:33,080 --> 00:01:35,520 If you guys don't know what that is, watch some of our other episodes. 22 00:01:35,740 --> 00:01:36,420 You can look it up yourself. 23 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:37,320 Actually, he recommended it. 24 00:01:37,320 --> 00:01:37,480 Yeah. 25 00:01:37,620 --> 00:01:38,900 Being called Joaquin. 26 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:42,380 And also, he's probably a big fan of Joaquin Phoenix's Joker. 27 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:43,280 Just kidding. 28 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:46,160 Anyway, Joaquin, thanks for being with us today. 29 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:49,020 Yeah, it's really incredible to have you with us. 30 00:01:49,180 --> 00:01:49,580 Thank you. 31 00:01:50,460 --> 00:01:53,960 I'd just like to say I have a confession to make. 32 00:01:54,220 --> 00:01:57,240 I still eat Frosted Flakes. 33 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:04,180 That was like the last thing in the world that I expected. 34 00:02:04,180 --> 00:02:08,500 I mean, do you guys remember those cheesy commercials from the 90s? 35 00:02:08,740 --> 00:02:09,020 All right. 36 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:14,380 If you don't, you're going to need to go onto YouTube and probably try to track them down. 37 00:02:14,380 --> 00:02:19,560 Yeah, yeah, type in Frosted Flakes 90s commercial where you're being questioned. 38 00:02:19,920 --> 00:02:20,140 Anyway. 39 00:02:20,500 --> 00:02:21,500 They're great! 40 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:24,300 Don't show up, you're a tiger. 41 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:27,540 Anyway, thank you very much for being with us. 42 00:02:27,540 --> 00:02:31,380 And we've got a chunk of time with you today. 43 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:38,020 And we kind of want you to bring us through just everything that's kind of happened to you. 44 00:02:38,020 --> 00:02:47,260 And especially even going in for the first time to, you know, one of the Masonic lodges and how all of that worked out. 45 00:02:47,640 --> 00:02:49,640 Did you have anything to add about how you'd like them to start? 46 00:02:49,740 --> 00:02:51,220 You can listen to a little bit more at this point. 47 00:02:51,340 --> 00:02:51,940 Yeah, really. 48 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:55,060 I mean, how this process even began. 49 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:58,840 Like, what made you decide to become, you know, part of the Freemasons? 50 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:01,080 And how did you even, what was your thinking? 51 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:02,320 Like, oh, yeah, I'm going to do this. 52 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,000 And how did it all pan out, basically? 53 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:08,740 I had heard of Masonry before. 54 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,780 I know there's some other Masons back in the family. 55 00:03:13,460 --> 00:03:19,800 And I actually got interested in it kind of as part of my own personal spiritual journey. 56 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:22,640 I was reading a lot. 57 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:23,960 I went to the library. 58 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:25,540 I was living in San Francisco at the time. 59 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:29,580 You know, there's all these books kind of related to Masonry. 60 00:03:29,580 --> 00:03:33,340 And they're basically occult books, for lack of a better description. 61 00:03:33,500 --> 00:03:41,080 They go by names like Theosophy or kind of Hermeticism, which Masonry is tangentially related to. 62 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:44,660 I can explain that a little bit, too. 63 00:03:45,180 --> 00:03:46,800 I was fresh out of college, you know. 64 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:57,820 And it's the kind of group that, you know, is kind of, you know, mysterious, but in a kind of alluring way to many people. 65 00:03:57,980 --> 00:04:01,420 Because, you know, you hear about all these big, you know, business people who are in it. 66 00:04:02,140 --> 00:04:04,280 And that turned out to be true, actually. 67 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:09,580 And so I got into it, basically interested in it, by reading about it. 68 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:14,000 And then I petitioned to join a lodge in the area. 69 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:20,240 And they, it's pretty thorough to get into Masonry, as you might imagine. 70 00:04:21,380 --> 00:04:26,860 They don't just let anybody in, even though they do now run ads, bizarrely, like saying, like, join Masonry. 71 00:04:26,860 --> 00:04:31,960 Right. So they're kind of like recruiting, but they do vet you. 72 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:34,620 In fact, they, they check out your family background. 73 00:04:34,820 --> 00:04:41,000 I specifically remember being this, this gentleman kind of pulled me up on his laptop. 74 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:45,260 And I kind of was next to him, so I saw his screen for a second. 75 00:04:45,380 --> 00:04:51,460 There was this kind of old school looking interface, kind of like an Excel spreadsheet, like green and black and gray. 76 00:04:51,460 --> 00:04:58,620 And it seemed to have, just based on my name, it seemed to have all kinds of information about me. 77 00:04:58,840 --> 00:05:04,700 And he was able to basically, you know, look at my family background. 78 00:05:05,980 --> 00:05:10,720 And he sort of told me that I was, in fact, eligible to join Masonry. 79 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:21,460 And I was also eligible to join some of the higher societies, such as the Society of Cincinnati and a few other, like, associated groups. 80 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:25,280 So just by looking, so they just looked at your name and your family background. 81 00:05:25,280 --> 00:05:27,820 And that was a deciding factor on how high you could go? 82 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:37,980 For those familiar with any of this, with Ben and Rob's show, bloodline is extremely important in Masonry. 83 00:05:37,980 --> 00:05:41,220 Ah, here it is! The Stonecutters! 84 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:45,400 Oh, this is it! My ticket in! They have to let me join if I'm a son of a member! 85 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:50,680 Coming through! Can't throw me out! My father's a member! I'm in! I'm in! 86 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:52,380 Okay, okay, homie, you're in! 87 00:05:52,920 --> 00:06:00,440 You could say it's like a central theme of Masonry, and they even give talks about it in Masonry. 88 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:09,460 They have people talk at the lodges about famous people and their lineages who were Masons, which itself is entirely fascinating. 89 00:06:09,460 --> 00:06:20,920 I've always been a student of history, and there's definitely a ton of historical people who have been Masons, which is, you know, itself really fascinating. 90 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:26,080 But that was just kind of the first step in the vetting process. 91 00:06:26,580 --> 00:06:37,360 They actually have to come visit your home, and not only one brother, but multiple brothers have to visit your home or vouch for you. 92 00:06:37,940 --> 00:06:43,140 Kind of like you put forward a motion, and someone else has to second it, and someone has to third it. 93 00:06:43,140 --> 00:06:49,920 In fact, you might have heard of this old term called blackballing someone. 94 00:06:50,460 --> 00:06:54,060 You know, that means that they're like persona non grata, right? 95 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:57,080 Take them off the airwaves or censor them or whatever. 96 00:06:57,700 --> 00:07:05,380 To blackball someone is something that I understood later actually comes from Masonry. 97 00:07:05,380 --> 00:07:13,900 Because in Masonry, when you are, when you're, it's called a ballot, when your ballot is put forward to join the lodge or your petition, 98 00:07:14,540 --> 00:07:21,480 the entire lodge has to vote on accepting you as a member, and it has to be unanimous. 99 00:07:21,940 --> 00:07:24,340 It cannot just be a majority vote. 100 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:32,980 So when you vote, they give everyone two balls, literal balls, and they pass a wooden ballot box around. 101 00:07:32,980 --> 00:07:36,260 One of those balls is white, and the other one is black. 102 00:07:36,900 --> 00:07:44,440 And all they have to do at the end of the voting when they open that ballot box up is if there's any black balls, the person is disqualified. 103 00:07:45,460 --> 00:07:47,600 So they call it being blackballed, naturally. 104 00:07:48,380 --> 00:07:51,600 So everyone has to approve of you. 105 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:52,340 Everyone. 106 00:07:53,200 --> 00:07:56,240 You know, I didn't have any, you know, thing in my family reputation. 107 00:07:56,380 --> 00:07:59,380 I hadn't had any fights with people in the lodge or whatsoever. 108 00:07:59,380 --> 00:08:03,420 So I was ultimately approved to join. 109 00:08:03,860 --> 00:08:08,580 Joining itself has stages. 110 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:12,680 I'm a, I'm a master Mason now, but you, you don't start out that way. 111 00:08:13,220 --> 00:08:18,740 Uh, you start out as what's called an entered apprentice and then a fellow craft. 112 00:08:18,740 --> 00:08:37,740 I mean, all that sounds, you know, very mysterious and all, uh, but basically, Masonry at its heart, or what's called, uh, Blue Lodge Masonry, which is the, the main, uh, you know, quote, unquote, orthodox Masonic lodges. 113 00:08:37,740 --> 00:08:41,580 Just like the name might imply, they are fraternities. 114 00:08:41,820 --> 00:08:43,540 There's no women allowed in Masonry. 115 00:08:43,620 --> 00:08:56,600 And it's just, it's just really at, at, in some ways, it's just a social club, uh, for men, you know, and it, it is, uh, in fact, a pretty fun, uh, club to be in. 116 00:08:56,600 --> 00:09:11,040 You know, the, the, the conversations and the company you have in the Masonic Lodge are very collegial and very, uh, you know, it's a nice experience in just, you know, that aspect of it. 117 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:17,040 There are all kinds of other interesting or more esoteric aspects. 118 00:09:17,420 --> 00:09:26,240 Um, I don't know, I don't know which part, you know, uh, what, what your guys' viewers would be interested to know about it. 119 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:28,560 I mean, I, I had a blast being in it. 120 00:09:28,860 --> 00:09:37,700 There were also times when I was a little bit, uh, you know, scared what I had gotten into, but in the end, you know, I, I mean. 121 00:09:38,180 --> 00:09:49,540 What you're saying is that there's definitely like a lure, like there's definitely a reason why gentlemen throughout history have entered the Masonic Lodge and, and become a brother within the Lodge, right? 122 00:09:49,940 --> 00:09:50,980 Correct. Correct. 123 00:09:50,980 --> 00:10:03,020 Kind of as a disclaimer, like my great grandfather was a Mason actually in Ohio, in Cleveland, and they actually helped build the local church in that community where he, where he lived. 124 00:10:03,020 --> 00:10:19,660 So, you know, we, what we've been told basically is that until you're really in the 33 level degree Mason, I mean, really like you were talking about, it's more of a social club where people get together and do things kind of for each other and for the community. 125 00:10:19,660 --> 00:10:29,780 And then it's kind of at the higher levels where the really, the esoteric cult, kind of the dark secret stuff starts kind of trickling through that. 126 00:10:29,900 --> 00:10:30,840 Is that correct? 127 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:43,200 I mean, it, it's definitely visible in the sense of what's called, uh, the ritual work, they call it ritual work. 128 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,440 And this is what takes place when the Lodge is in session. 129 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:50,520 So you have casual meetings and then you have Lodge in session. 130 00:10:51,180 --> 00:10:54,920 When it's in session, everyone is in full, uh, tuxedo. 131 00:10:54,920 --> 00:11:07,160 You dress very formally, extremely formally, there's a certain decorum that's observed in terms of the order of speaking and that order of speaking is based on rank. 132 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:14,840 And you have to kind of like senators do, uh, ask for your turn to talk, so to speak. 133 00:11:14,840 --> 00:11:22,600 There's the more casual, like get togethers between the brothers that are not, uh, uh, in session. 134 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:41,600 And, you know, those are just the, the fun stuff you could say, but, uh, yeah, I mean, Masonry has a side that is extremely old, you know, a lot of presidents and even before the U S long before the U S there were lodges and people in them. 135 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:52,600 So, you know, very high level people, you know, George Washington was a Mason, Lincoln was a Mason, pretty much all the presidents, as I understand it, up until the last two, actually, 136 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:58,600 were, were, were Masons. Some people say George W. was not a Mason, but he was definitely in- 137 00:11:58,600 --> 00:11:59,600 The Skull and Bones. 138 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:06,600 Yeah, he was in Skull and Bones and he was in other Masonically affiliated, uh, organizations. 139 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:17,600 Now, there's a lot of stuff I think over time in history that is borrowed from Freemasonry or borrowed the, the symbolism and the organizational structure of Freemasonry. 140 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:24,600 So that's where people get the idea or start to think that there's all this occult stuff in Masonry. 141 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:35,600 But actually a lot of that stuff belongs to paramasonic lodges or what we would call affiliated lodges that are not part of Blue Lodge Masonry. 142 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:45,600 So Blue Lodge Masonry is any lodge that has F and AM as the letters. So that stands for Free and Accepted Mason. 143 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:57,600 If you have AF and AM or if you have some other designation like Prince Hall or, uh, there's some other ones that are affiliated with, uh, Rosicrucianism, which I also was in, uh, briefly. 144 00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:06,600 Uh, that organization I wanted no part of, uh, after attending, uh, a meeting and I quickly exited that. 145 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:07,600 And your, what happened? 146 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:19,600 Rosicrucianism is, um, is associated with York Wright degree of, of Freemasonry, which is the, uh, Knights Templar, leads to the Knights Templar degree. 147 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:27,600 There's an 18th degree, uh, before that, which is called Knights, Knights Rose Croy or Rosy Cross. 148 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:37,600 And they had a similar, uh, function in history to the Templars in that they were Christian leaning, or let's call it so-called Christian, 149 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:43,600 because it's, it's not what most people would think of as Orthodox Christianity, to be quite clear. 150 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:48,600 Um, you know, there's all kinds of stories about them that have been popularized by, you know, Dan Brown and others. 151 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:55,600 You know, that they, you know, guarded travelers in the Holy Land and, and, you know, stored, also stored their valuables for them, 152 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:58,600 which is how the Vatican kind of got into banking. 153 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:04,600 Some people say because they would, they would store the valuables for people who were making a pilgrimage to the Holy Land. 154 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:08,600 So there's that kind of, you know, historical footnote about them. 155 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:17,600 But the, yeah, so, so modern Rosicrucianism, at least my experience of it, um, you know, it's, it's like a bunch of people who, 156 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:26,600 who are kind of spiritually seeking, you might say, but they've kind of taken a, what I would consider a detour, 157 00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:36,600 and are using, uh, basically methods which amount to, uh, black magic, or like something you might learn in the secret. 158 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:45,600 I keenly remember one person at the Rosicrucian meeting saying how he used one of the techniques to find parking. 159 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:49,600 Now, this is San Francisco, mind you. Parking is really hard to find. Like, I get it. 160 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:54,600 You know, but I'm like, I'm like, damn, really? You're using black magic to find parking. 161 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:58,600 I mean, it's, you know, it's, it's at this kind of level of... 162 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:01,600 Well, just call it what it is. You're a loser, dude. 163 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:06,600 You have to be a very particular level of loser to use, you know. 164 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:10,600 And they do. They meet, you know, in, in Rosicrucianism, some of the people wear black robes. 165 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:15,600 You meet literally in the middle of the woods. I, I, I don't know where, I don't know actually where I was, 166 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:21,600 but I had to drive way into like the Marin, uh, headlands, you know, up there in Northern California, 167 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:28,600 where there's all kinds of stuff going on as we know. Um, and you know, they meet literally in the middle of the woods, 168 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:34,600 you know, like it's just so suspect, you know, I'm like, look, I, you know, I don't want, I don't know where this goes. 169 00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:38,600 You know, some of these people are kind of, you know, I just don't want any part of it. 170 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,600 So I just left that whole thing aside and didn't, didn't go anymore. 171 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:48,600 You know, in, in some ways it's a kind of like a witch's coven by another name. 172 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:56,600 I mean, they, they dress it up. They have all this fancy sounding stuff to make it sound, you know, better than that. 173 00:15:56,600 --> 00:16:01,600 But, uh, the techniques that teach kind of amount to that, but that just to be clear, 174 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:07,600 that is not strictly speaking part of Blue Lodge masonry. 175 00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:08,600 I see. 176 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:14,600 The two definitely know each other. And if you're a Rose Croy degree, it doesn't mean you're a Rosicrucian, 177 00:16:14,600 --> 00:16:19,600 but they have like, I don't know, a sister city relationship for lack of a better word. 178 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:25,600 So the people who are in them, um, you know, masonry in a lot of ways, 179 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:29,600 from what I read before when I was on my, you know, spiritual journey, 180 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:35,600 has a lot to do with Hermeticism or what in history has, has been called Hermeticism. 181 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:39,600 Um, and, and this, this kind of idea of mystery lodges. 182 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:44,600 And the rites and rituals and things that you get into in masonry 183 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:50,600 look like the things from Hermeticism or the old Egyptian mystery lodges. 184 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:56,600 In fact, uh, we have all these lodge rooms in the New York, uh, on 23rd street there. 185 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:03,600 They're, they're like themed rooms. And I even, I even have been in a bunch of them. 186 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:09,600 You know, we have like an Egyptian themed room and it has like all the Egyptian symbolism you would expect. 187 00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:15,600 It has the, you know, the eye of Horus and all the, the little symbol that the neo-Nazis have taken to using 188 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:21,600 and all this stuff. And there's other themed rooms too. There's like a Babylonian themed room. 189 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:30,600 There's a Persian themed room. There's a, you know, they just love this kind of pageantry and these old world symbolism. 190 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:35,600 Out of curiosity, do they do that because they feel like they're responsible for all of those things? 191 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:37,600 Like that they were a part of that history? 192 00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:41,600 They're claiming tangential relationship to that history. 193 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:46,600 They're not claiming, you know, they're not going full, uh, history channel and ancient aliens 194 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:54,600 and saying, you know, we created all this, but they're saying, uh, we were, we were in the room, you know, so to speak. 195 00:17:54,600 --> 00:18:03,600 You know, um, you know, because masonry, they don't take themselves as so seriously in the sense of, you know, 196 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:09,600 that some conspiracy people will say about them. Like if you read Jim Mars or something, you know, 197 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:14,600 you know, he comes at masonry, uh, like it's just deadly serious all the time. 198 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:21,600 And honestly, you know, they're internally, they're a bit, uh, tongue in cheek about some of this stuff. 199 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:28,600 You know, they know that history is there, but they, they, you know, uh, another thing I have to clarify is like, 200 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:33,600 I think you have two kinds of people who participate in, in masonry. 201 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:39,600 People who really do go at it for some kind of spiritual aspect that they're seeking. 202 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:44,600 And others who are just basically there for the brotherhood and maybe the business connections. 203 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,600 You know, so you have people who maybe even their family's been in it for a while, 204 00:18:48,600 --> 00:18:52,600 but it's just like if your family's in the Catholic Church, right? 205 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:57,600 It doesn't make you a devout, uh, believer on Sunday, right? 206 00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:01,600 You could just be there for the, you know, for the, for the cheap wine, right? 207 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:07,600 I mean, you know, you just, uh, you know, not everybody, uh, is, is like full on, like, 208 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:15,600 but they are, you know, there are some extremely, uh, well-connected and wealthy people in masonry. 209 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:17,600 Uh, I'll just give you an example. 210 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:25,600 There's a lodge called Holland Lodge No. 8, um, which, which I'm basically affiliated with. 211 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:27,600 Uh, this is a very old lodge. 212 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:32,600 They have a beautiful, uh, library that they maintain as part of the masonic system. 213 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:39,600 They actually have the, uh, Bible that George Washington was obligated on when he took the oath of office. 214 00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:43,600 It's, it's in a gold case, glass case in, in there. 215 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,600 Uh, and they have all kinds of beautiful, rare books. 216 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:51,600 They have a, they have a library, which, um, I know you guys wanted me to talk about, and I will, 217 00:19:51,600 --> 00:20:01,600 that has on the top floor, it has a, uh, a rare book room, which is just exquisite books with, you know, gild edging. 218 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:09,600 Even the shelves are all beautiful gold leaf and everything that you would expect of being really old and really valuable. 219 00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:13,600 And, you know, they'll let you go see them. 220 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:20,600 You, you have a minder who, who, you know, make sure the books aren't harmed, but, uh, you know, you can see them. 221 00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,600 You can, if you're amazing, it's only for members. 222 00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:31,600 I, I think maybe members and their guests, but, um, I think probably mostly members, which means all men, essentially. 223 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,600 And you're, you have to be amazing to get in there. 224 00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:37,600 You know, there's, there's a lot of history there. 225 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:42,600 And I think a lot of people who may be in it today, some of them are aware, but some of them are not. 226 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:49,600 Um, but I'll just give you an example of, you know, Holland Lodge No. 8 is a really old lodge. 227 00:20:49,600 --> 00:21:01,600 And it's, it's written about in other books on, you know, as a source of meetings, which have to do with other different higher, you know, society groups. 228 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:03,600 You know, I'll just give you an example. 229 00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:09,600 Some of the people who are members of the lodge, um, that I know for sure are members. 230 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,600 Um, we do have an Aster in there. 231 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:20,600 Uh, there is the, the, the, the CEO, uh, at least at the time that I was heavily, you know, going to those meetings. 232 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:25,600 Uh, the CEO at that time of Citibank, uh, is a member of that lodge. 233 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:29,600 The tie, uh, from that lodge is very unique. 234 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:37,600 So there's a, there's a tie, uh, that everyone in the lodge wears at the casual, uh, meetings. 235 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:39,600 Because in the, in the full meetings, you're in tuxedo. 236 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:43,600 But at the casual meetings, people take to wearing this necktie. 237 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:45,600 And it's a very specific tie. 238 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:53,600 The person who I have a photo of wearing it, I'm not confirmed that he's a member of, uh, our lodge. 239 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:59,600 But that's, uh, uh, the Duke of, of England, you know. 240 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:01,600 And you know this because of the tie? 241 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:02,600 Because of the tie. 242 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:09,600 So he wore, uh, the tie in a meeting, I think, with the World, uh, World Financial Forum. 243 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,600 He wore the tie of our lodge. 244 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:19,600 So at least, uh, he, he knows of our lodge and possibly is a member. 245 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:23,600 I never saw him in attendance, but I wouldn't necessarily, you know. 246 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,600 Some people, uh, do not come that often. 247 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:30,600 You know, the, the lodge meets fairly regularly for social occasions. 248 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:35,600 And obviously some of these business people, uh, don't always make it. 249 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:37,600 You know, they're very busy people. 250 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:42,600 Um, our lodge had a ton of, you know, hedge fund managers. 251 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:47,600 I mean, almost everyone who I met was in some finance capacity in that lodge. 252 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:49,600 They all worked in finance. 253 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,600 You know, they were all white. 254 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:58,600 I hate to say it, but they were literally, it's, uh, it's, it's as good and old of an old boys club as you get. 255 00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:01,600 I mean, 50, 60 plus a lot of them. 256 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:12,600 And there are racial divisions in, uh, masonry that are not strict, but that are casually observed, you could say. 257 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:20,600 So there is a lodge, uh, you know, a grouping of, of masons for Chinese people. 258 00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:22,600 It's called the Acacia Club. 259 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:32,600 And it's based on the story that when King Solomon, uh, fell while he was traveling, he used the, uh, root of an acacia to pull himself up. 260 00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:37,600 And it symbolizes, uh, one race helping another. 261 00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,600 And it's a very, um, it's a very nice metaphor. 262 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:47,600 There's another lodge called, uh, Prince Hall Masonry, which is basically for black people. 263 00:23:47,600 --> 00:24:03,600 And, uh, the, the notion there was that Prince Hall was an actual prince and he was, uh, a very important early, uh, free, uh, black man, uh, who did a lot of things with masonry. 264 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:12,600 In my research, I found that Hall is actually one of the sub bloodline names in the, um, in the, of the 13 main families. 265 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:19,600 Each family name has several sub names that kind of, they bled into for lack of a better way to describe it. 266 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:21,600 So, um, I did hear that. 267 00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:26,600 And it's interesting though, that, that the Prince Hall was related and, um, Hall was one of the names that I came across. 268 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:38,600 It's, it's entirely possible and they claim descent of the Black Moors who were, uh, fought against during the Crusades. 269 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:46,600 Maybe related to Saracen, who was the leader of the, like, Moorish Islamic people way back in, in history. 270 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:47,600 I, I don't know. 271 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:55,600 It's popular in masonry for different lodges and different people to claim descent of something or someone famous, 272 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,600 not unlike in antebellum England or America. 273 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:00,600 It was also popular to do the same thing. 274 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:07,600 So masonry has retained that tradition of lineage and the heritage passing to, you know, 275 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:09,600 a firstborn son of a firstborn son. 276 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:17,600 And, you know, there's all, there's all these things like that that are still, the pageantry of them still exists inside of masonry, 277 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:22,600 which makes it a very old world feeling place when you go into it. 278 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,600 And I think that's one reason some people like it too. 279 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:33,600 They, they like being almost like transported back to this whole other way of, of thinking, you know, um, 280 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:37,600 whether they're in it for some of those more occult elements or what. 281 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,600 Or financial reasons, right? 282 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:45,600 Or financial reasons, but they, they may like it for that reason because it does have so much history. 283 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,600 They, they own a lot of buildings. 284 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,600 They have very beautiful buildings, very beautiful libraries. 285 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:54,600 And you came across a specific book in one of those libraries, right? 286 00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:56,600 Well, I came across several books. 287 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:57,600 I mean. 288 00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:03,600 And you can explain like what these libraries are compared to like normal libraries, right? 289 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:04,600 Like these are restricted. 290 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:05,600 Yeah. 291 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:09,600 So these libraries, so the one that I went to is called the Scottish Rite Library. 292 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:15,600 It's in San Francisco near, um, near the very tony, uh, like St. Francis Wood area. 293 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:18,600 And, uh, it is a private library. 294 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:24,600 And when you go there, they do give you a kind of a minder who is there to kind of help you. 295 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:31,600 Like they give you like cookies and tea and stuff, but they're, uh, sitting with you as you, you know, not. 296 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:33,600 With a taser so that you don't destroy the book. 297 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:36,600 You know, they do take some precautions there. 298 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:45,600 Um, but the books I found, which I then later tried to find outside of this library and could not, were utterly fascinating. 299 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:52,600 Um, I remember one book specifically, and I'll give the title, and I have yet to be able to find this book on any kind of Google search 300 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:57,600 or any kind of even mention of this book in anybody else's research. 301 00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:59,600 So it's, it's pretty fascinating to me. 302 00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:03,600 So the book was called Cyclical Economics. 303 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:08,600 And the purported author was none other than Andrew Carnegie. 304 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:09,600 No way. 305 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:14,600 It was very beautiful, like leather bound, uh, volume, or I don't know if it was crocodile skin. 306 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:16,600 I don't know, some kind of textured thing. 307 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:21,600 And with gold lettering, it basically, for lack of a better purpose, 308 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:26,600 I, I sat there and read it eagerly because I was like, this is so strange and kind of exciting. 309 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:32,600 I didn't know that it was such a rare thing at the time, but I have yet to be able to find it elsewhere since then, 310 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,600 even with extensive online search. 311 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:48,600 Uh, he basically has a, a very developed theory for how to time cycles, natural, naturally occurring cycles in the economy, 312 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:53,600 so as to inform yourself when to, uh, when to invest. 313 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:58,600 And he says these, these cycles occur, you know, I, I believe it was like every seven years, 314 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:03,600 but then it, it gets, uh, a little bit shorter as time goes on. 315 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:08,600 This sounds very pseudoscience-y, like astrological or something. 316 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:09,600 And numerology. 317 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:14,600 I think a lot of these guys, it's pretty well known that Reagan was into astrology, for instance. 318 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:22,600 I think a lot of these guys who are into masonry are also into metaphysical stuff. 319 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:27,600 There's a ton of books just on metaphysics in there that you can find elsewhere. 320 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:29,600 A lot of them are pretty dark. 321 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:31,600 Uh, they have the C.W. Ledbetter stuff. 322 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:33,600 They have the Helena Blatsky stuff. 323 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:35,600 They have the Alistair Crowley stuff. 324 00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:42,600 They have a guy named Albert Pike, who's really big in masonry and is also into that kind of stuff. 325 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,600 And they have a huge mural when you first come into this library on the wall. 326 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:52,600 Huge mural, like what you might see of like in a church of Jesus on the Stations of the Cross. 327 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:58,600 And it's this very important figure in masonry, Jacques de Molay. 328 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:06,600 Not unlike Jesus being depicted on the cross, the death of Jacques de Molay is being depicted. 329 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:11,600 He's being burned on a pyre, which is essentially how he died. 330 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,600 They killed him by burning him alive. 331 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:18,600 Interestingly enough, he was killed on Friday the 13th. 332 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:26,600 And that's why that day for history after that point is seen as, you know, a cursed day. 333 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,600 Right, because Jacques de Molay died on this day. 334 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:32,600 And he was a major figure in the Crusades. 335 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:39,600 And he's pictured in other places with his giant red cross on a white field like many of those crusaders have. 336 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:47,600 And very heroically, like you might picture Christ or even like those Soviet paintings where they have the boy with the hammer kind of, you know. 337 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:51,600 He's just like this big figure in masonry. 338 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,600 And he's all over the Scottish Rite Library. 339 00:29:54,600 --> 00:30:01,600 Hey guys, this is all the time we have for today on this episode with Joaquin. 340 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:03,600 But tune in for the next one. 341 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,600 Joaquin the Masonic Mystery. 342 00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:07,600 Yeah! 343 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:12,600 Two things are forbidden to be talked about in a lodge while it's in session. 344 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:18,600 I can't even find these books on any kind of internet search or in any other library and I've tried. 345 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:33,600 One of the things you've got to understand is Masons, through all the ritual work, through all the degrees, through all the pageantry of the lodge opening and closing, are loyal to each other. 346 00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:40,600 John Dewey was literally an occult numerologist. 347 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:48,600 Masons have a rotating chairmanship, as it were, called the master of the lodge. 348 00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:55,600 And you rotate over the course of several years, often, through different stations of the lodge. 349 00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:56,600 Thanks. 350 00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:57,600 Bye. 351 00:30:57,600 --> 00:30:59,600 INTER semi nucleus? 352 00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:02,600 There are proposals are filed here. 353 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:03,600 Almost observed. 354 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:04,600 Jugend 24 355 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:06,600 He paid them for Jerome. 356 00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:08,600 He's going to get people fixed. 357 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:10,600 He's going to call me América. 358 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:11,600 He's going to call you Mary. 359 00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:13,600 The engraving processes of wurden through all the computers and the machines. 360 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:15,200 Noah Schumann who bought Gaiman.