1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,000 Manson has been serving his time at this prison in Vacaville, California, isolated... 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Manson's first television interview since the murders begins badly. 3 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:18,000 I told you I'm not going to sit in that damn chair. I'll stand here and talk with the... 4 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:24,000 Manson refuses to sit in the chair provided. He says he's not going to look up to anyone. 5 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:29,000 But finally, Tom Snyder of the National Broadcasting Company asks his first question. 6 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:34,000 You know, you were sentenced to the gas chamber and then they modified the death... 7 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:37,000 Was I happy when what was done? 8 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:39,000 When you found out that you weren't going to the gas chamber. 9 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:43,000 You're talking about dying. Now it gets me nervous. 10 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:44,000 Why? 11 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:48,000 Did you have any thoughts about something? Was you wanting to go anywhere? 12 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:55,000 Were you happy when you found out you weren't going to go to the gas chamber, Charles? 13 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:59,000 I knew I wasn't going to go to the gas chamber because I hadn't done anything wrong. 14 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:04,000 You're scared to die? 15 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:13,000 Sometimes I feel I'm scared to live. Living is what scares me. Dying is easy. 16 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:16,000 How long have I been in jail? 34 years? 17 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:19,000 34 years, so... 18 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:21,000 Out of 47, you've been here 34. 19 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:28,000 I've been in jail, prison, a long time, all my life. I was raised up in here. 20 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:32,000 So I understand jail. So I understand myself and I can deal with that. 21 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:37,000 I set myself and I do my number like a convict does his number. 22 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:41,000 But there's different colors on different people's backs doing different things. 23 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:46,000 There's a different world. I love the world I live in, too, just like Regan loves the wo... 24 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:48,000 You love the world you live in. 25 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:50,000 You love the world you live in. 26 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,000 Most assuredly, it's me. 27 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:56,000 You love all the pain that you've caused people, all the anguish you've caused people. 28 00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:03,000 I don't know pain. I have no depth of pain. I have no depth of suffering. I don't know... 29 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:09,000 I don't know all the bad things. I haven't been punished by you all my life since I w... 30 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:11,000 I've been in every reform school you got across the country. 31 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:15,000 And you used to lay down and have to get my ass whipped until I couldn't walk. 32 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:16,000 Tell me about some pain. 33 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:18,000 And that's our fault. That's all those people want. 34 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:22,000 No, no, it's fault. Make strong, good pain. Understand pain. Not bad. 35 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:27,000 Pain's not bad. It's good. It teaches you things. 36 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:33,000 It teaches you things. Like when you put your hand in fire, oh, you know not to do that... 37 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,000 Yeah, I understand that. 38 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:42,000 Written accounts indicate that you told the authorities, don't let me out. I can't cop... 39 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:43,000 Do you have a recollection of that? 40 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:48,000 Make a desperate plea out of something, man. There's no desperate plea out of it. 41 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:51,000 I say I can't handle the maniacs outside. Let me back in. 42 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:54,000 I didn't use the word desperate. That's your word, Charles. 43 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:59,000 Yeah, well, your inflection and your voice tones were implications there. 44 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:08,000 Well, you use the word maniacs on the outside. How are you different from the... 45 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:13,000 And why do you call them maniacs? Because you know something? They think you are one. 46 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:21,000 Yeah, it would reflect. If you hold the negative up to the light, you don't see th... 47 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:25,000 So I'm a reflection of your negative. There's no doubt about that. And I can handle that... 48 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:27,000 I've been handling, ain't I? 49 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:28,000 I don't know. Have you? 50 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:33,000 Well, I've been up and down these damn hallways, in and out of these nut wards fo... 51 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:37,000 You think you could follow that act? I'm playing for my life. You're working for... 52 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:44,000 When you say you're playing for your life, am I to assume that you think that someday... 53 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:53,000 Get out of here? Get out of here. Where would I go now, see? 54 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:59,000 What would you do if you got out of here? What if they said to you tomorrow morning,... 55 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:02,000 You can go wherever you want to go. Do whatever you want to do. What would you do? 56 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:07,000 I'd probably go out in front of the grass and sit down. 57 00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:11,000 The question is, should Manson ever go free? 58 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:18,000 It's ten years now since he and his three female accomplices, virtually robots under... 59 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:25,000 On August the 9th, 1969, they murdered actress Sharon Tate and four other people ... 60 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:30,000 The following night, there were two more victims, Lino and Rosemary LaBianca. 61 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:35,000 In court, Manson was also charged with two more mutilation murders. 62 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:41,000 Ranch Hand Donald Shea was beheaded, and musician Gary Heineman had his ear cut off. 63 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:48,000 According to some accounts, Manson and his family may have been responsible for as ma... 64 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:52,000 If you got out of here, there are a lot of people who think you'd go start killing... 65 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:57,000 Again? Before you guys had misinformed, I haven't killed anyone. 66 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:02,000 I didn't break the law. The judge knew that. But the people didn't want to hear it. 67 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:07,000 The judge knew it. He washed his hands. He said, I know it, but what can I do? People... 68 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:09,000 The judge never said it. The judge never said it. 69 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:10,000 That's what the older said. 70 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:11,000 No, the judge didn't say that. 71 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:14,000 He got off and shook their hands, didn't he? You're so white and pure. 72 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:16,000 The judge didn't say you were innocent. 73 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:17,000 Are you innocent? 74 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:18,000 Innocent of what? 75 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:19,000 Oh, that's what I'm saying. 76 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:20,000 None of us are innocent. 77 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:23,000 Yeah, just because you're convicted in a courtroom doesn't mean you're guilty of... 78 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:24,000 What does mean you're guilty? 79 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:25,000 When you know you're guilty. 80 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:26,000 What about Shea? 81 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:27,000 What about him? 82 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:28,000 Well, what about him? 83 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:29,000 He got killed. 84 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:31,000 Well, the word is you killed him. 85 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:36,000 Word is that you're an old woman. Word is you have turkey in the sky. 86 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:39,000 Word is, I don't know what word is. Somebody else tell you that. I didn't tell you that. 87 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:40,000 Did you kill Shea? 88 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:41,000 Hell no. 89 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:42,000 Did you cut the human's ear off? 90 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:43,000 Hell, yes. 91 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:46,000 How did that feel when you cut his ear off? 92 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,000 What did it feel like? 93 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:49,000 Yeah. 94 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:54,000 Well, I had done what he said for about 20 years. 95 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:57,000 I'd done everything he told me to do. 96 00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:02,000 And I got to thinking now, why don't this guy do something I tell him to do? 97 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,000 And he said, no. 98 00:06:04,000 --> 00:06:11,000 I said, well, how comes I'm always doing what you tell me to do, but then you never do w... 99 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:14,000 And he said, well, blah, blah, blah. 100 00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:17,000 So I said, now you do what I say. 101 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:19,000 And he said, no. 102 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:22,000 I said, you do exactly what I say. 103 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:23,000 And he said, no. 104 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:27,000 I'm telling you. I'm not asking you. I'm telling you. 105 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:29,000 You do exactly what I say. 106 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:36,000 And that's about the extent of it. All this all cult, all that hocus pocus stuff that ... 107 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:40,000 You know nothing about something called helter skelter. Tell me, Charles, I don't... 108 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:42,000 It's a fairy, it's worse than a fairy tale. 109 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:43,000 It's a fairy tale. 110 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:46,000 It's a comedy. It's a comedy tragedy. 111 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,000 The body of Sharon Tate is make believe. 112 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:49,000 That's make believe. 113 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:50,000 Make believe, yeah. 114 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:53,000 That's make believe to the people that went in there and did what they did. 115 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:54,000 And who were those people? 116 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:55,000 You know who. 117 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:56,000 But you know who they were. 118 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:57,000 Sure I know who they were. 119 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,000 They were with you at the Spahn Ranch. 120 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:04,000 They were part of this thing called, if not the Manson family or the Manson cult, the... 121 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:05,000 Call it what you will. 122 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:07,000 So then what? 123 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,000 You dealt the hand down in LA. 124 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:11,000 You and that press, you dealt the hand. 125 00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:15,000 You put me on Life magazine, had me convicted before I walked into court room. 126 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:17,000 You had what people wanted to buy. 127 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:20,000 When they wanted to buy it, they didn't give a damn if they had to convict a district... 128 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:24,000 They had to convict the whole building to get that dollar bill going there. 129 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:25,000 They had big bucks going there. 130 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:27,000 He made $27,000,000,000,000,000,000. 131 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:30,000 I'm bumming $10, $15 for my friend here. 132 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:35,000 Here's another newspaper account that you can now speak to since you haven't done it... 133 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:40,000 That on the night following the killings at the house on Cielo Drive in Los Angeles, 134 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:47,000 you accompanied four people to a home occupied by Mr. and Mrs. Leo LaBianca. 135 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:53,000 That you went inside that house and you tied them up and assured them that they were no... 136 00:07:53,000 --> 00:08:00,000 That you went back outside and sent Casabian and Krenwinkel and Watson and Atkins insid... 137 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:02,000 True or false? 138 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:04,000 Mm-hmm. 139 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,000 Did you do that? 140 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:13,000 Chair's getting hot, huh? 141 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:25,000 Did you do that? 142 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,000 Did I kill anyone? 143 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:28,000 No. 144 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:30,000 Did you go in and tie up the LaBiancas that night? 145 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:32,000 Very simple question. 146 00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:34,000 That night? 147 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,000 August 10th, 1969. 148 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,000 That night, August 10th, 1969. 149 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:39,000 Did you? 150 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:40,000 Why duck it? Why dodge it? 151 00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:42,000 Why not answer it yes or no once and for all? 152 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,000 Put it behind you. 153 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:46,000 Did I kill anyone? 154 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:48,000 Did you tie up the LaBiancas? 155 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:00,000 Atkins testified you did. 156 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:04,000 I did. 157 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:06,000 I did. 158 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:08,000 I did. 159 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:10,000 I did. 160 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:12,000 Atkins testified you did. 161 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:16,000 That's what Suzy said? 162 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:18,000 That's what she said. 163 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:20,000 And you remember it. You were in the courtroom when she said it. 164 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:22,000 She's written three books and each time she said something different. 165 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:24,000 Each time. 166 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:26,000 Did you tie them up? 167 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:28,000 Did I? 168 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,000 Well, we came down from Abilene. 169 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,000 Let's stay in Los Angeles. August 10th, 1969. 170 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:36,000 There was a hole in the wall gang there. 171 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,000 Why don't you want to talk about it, Charles? 172 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:44,000 Why don't you want to? 173 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:46,000 Because I'm an outlaw and I go so far and then that's all you know. 174 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:54,000 And if you did... 175 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:56,000 I'm like asking Jesse James. 176 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:58,000 And if as others have written and as others have testified and as the media has report... 177 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:00,000 And if as others have written and as others have testified and as the media has report... 178 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,000 And if as others have written and as others have testified and as the media has report... 179 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,000 And you sent your friends back in to do the deed. Aren't you a coward? 180 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,000 And you sent your friends back in to do the deed. Aren't you a coward? 181 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:08,000 My friends back in to do the terrible deed. 182 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:10,000 The wicked deed. 183 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,000 Did we have the castle there with the vampires and the Frankenstein 184 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:14,000 Did we have the castle there with the vampires and the Frankenstein 185 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:16,000 And the bugs and lizards dying in the deserts? 186 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:18,000 And the bugs and lizards dying in the deserts? 187 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:20,000 Did we have the water that's dying and the whales are being killed and the seals are... 188 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:22,000 Did we have the water that's dying and the whales are being killed and the seals are... 189 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,000 Here we go again. Lay it off on somebody else. 190 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:26,000 Let's point to all the other injustices. 191 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:28,000 I'm in the world all by myself? 192 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,000 Yeah. 193 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:32,000 On this one you are. 194 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:34,000 Yeah. 195 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:36,000 It was okay. 196 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 197 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:40,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 198 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:42,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 199 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:44,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 200 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:46,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 201 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:48,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 202 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 203 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:52,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 204 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:54,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 205 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 206 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:58,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 207 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:00,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 208 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 209 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:04,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 210 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:06,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 211 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:08,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 212 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 213 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 214 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:14,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 215 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:16,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 216 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:18,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 217 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 218 00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:22,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 219 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 220 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 221 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 222 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:30,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 223 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,000 I'm in the world all by myself. 224 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:34,000 You're damn right. 225 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,000 Yeah. 226 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:38,000 What do you think of women? 227 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,000 Oh, I like them. Yeah, they're nice. 228 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,000 They're put together well and everything. 229 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:44,000 And they're soft and spongy. Yeah, they're nice. 230 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:46,000 As long as they keep their mouths shut 231 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:48,000 and do what they're supposed to do. 232 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,000 Why do you say that? 233 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:52,000 Because that's what a woman's supposed to do. 234 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:54,000 Keep her mouth shut and do what she's supposed to do? 235 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,000 Sure. 236 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:58,000 And besides the son that you had in your marriage, 237 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:00,000 you've got what, four other children somewhere? 238 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:04,000 I'm responsible for as much as you people want to lay on me. 239 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,000 All right, somewhere out there, somewhere, 240 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,000 there's at least one son that we know of that's your child, 241 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:10,000 who's probably about 25 or 26 years old. 242 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:12,000 You talk to that kid. 243 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:14,000 What are you going to say to him? 244 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:16,000 You've got to catch it on your own, boy. 245 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:20,000 Train's hard. The road's rough. 246 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,000 And that's it. 247 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:26,000 That's all I knew. 248 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:28,000 That's all anyone ever told me. 249 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:32,000 And you want to hear something? 250 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,000 Yeah. 251 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:36,000 He'll do it better than me. 252 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:38,000 Do what? 253 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,000 Whatever he does. 254 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,000 He'll do it a little better. 255 00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:44,000 Kids do, don't they? 256 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:46,000 Sometimes. 257 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:48,000 That's what makes them such a cast. 258 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,000 They always seem to get through. 259 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,000 How were you in school? 260 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:54,000 I hear that you weren't too good, but maybe I heard more. 261 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,000 Depends on which school. 262 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:58,000 I did very well in reform school. 263 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:00,000 I was ever told to do good in. 264 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,000 I've been an outlaw ever since I was born. 265 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,000 I went to reform school when I was about 10. 266 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:08,000 And I learned to box and cry. 267 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:10,000 And I learned to do all the things that you do in reform school. 268 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:14,000 Then I went to, I escaped there a bunch of times, 269 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:16,000 and I went to prison. 270 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:18,000 And I learned everything that you do in prison. 271 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:20,000 And I talked to all the guys and asked them everything they knew. 272 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,000 And they told me all the things they knew. 273 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:26,000 And then I went to the end of it, 274 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:28,000 and I said, well, I'm going to be a good man. 275 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,000 I'm going to be a good man. 276 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:32,000 I'm going to be a good man. 277 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:34,000 I'm going to be a good man. 278 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:36,000 I'm going to be a good man. 279 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:38,000 I'm going to be a good man. 280 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:40,000 I'm going to be a good man. 281 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:42,000 I'm going to be a good man. 282 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:44,000 I'm going to be a good man. 283 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,000 I'm going to be a good man. 284 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:48,000 I'm going to be a good man. 285 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:50,000 I'm going to be a good man. 286 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:52,000 I'm going to be a good man. 287 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:54,000 I'm going to be a good man. 288 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:56,000 Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'll take a look at my life and say, 289 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,000 well, I'm going to change it and start all over. 290 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,000 You know? 291 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:02,000 And I know I go to God and I say, hey, man, 292 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:04,000 you're going to forgive me? And he's going to say, 293 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,000 what do you do? You forgive you? 294 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,000 I mean, what did you come to me for? 295 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,000 Forgive yourself, man. Don't be bothering me. 296 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:12,000 How do you feel about spending 297 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:14,000 the rest of your life in prison? 298 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:16,000 Well, 299 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,000 we're all our own prisons. 300 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:20,000 We each are our own wardens, 301 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:22,000 and we do our own times. 302 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:24,000 We're stuck in our own little trips, 303 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:26,000 and we kind of judge ourselves the way we do. 304 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:28,000 You know? 305 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:30,000 I can't judge nobody else. 306 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:32,000 The best thing I can do is try to judge myself 307 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,000 and live with that. 308 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,000 Let's assume that one day 309 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:38,000 you were paroled. 310 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:40,000 Let's just make believe. 311 00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:42,000 Do you ever think you will be? 312 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,000 Yeah, do I ever think I will be? 313 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:46,000 Well, I've never been paroled before. 314 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:48,000 I went up to the board, 315 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:50,000 and they said I was incongruent. 316 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:52,000 Yeah, I was incorrigible. 317 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:54,000 And not only was I incorrigible, 318 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:56,000 but I never grow up. 319 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:58,000 And I kind of agreed with them. 320 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,000 If you got out tomorrow, 321 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,000 do you have any scores to settle on the outside? 322 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:04,000 Scores? 323 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,000 Do I have any scores out there? 324 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,000 And we're making believe, right? 325 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:10,000 Well, I'll tell you, buddy. 326 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,000 Well, I don't rightly know. 327 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:24,000 I'm stupid 328 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,000 to the point 329 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:28,000 where I'm not really sure. 330 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:30,000 Believe it or not, 331 00:15:30,000 --> 00:15:32,000 there are a lot of people on the outside 332 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:34,000 that think about the possibility 333 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,000 of you coming out of here, 334 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:38,000 and they're genuinely scared of you. 335 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:40,000 Oh, boy, I might just make dust. 336 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,000 Everything. Terrible. 337 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:44,000 One little guy, 338 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:46,000 and I'm not afraid of him. 339 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,000 I'm not afraid of him. 340 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,000 Everything. Terrible. 341 00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:52,000 One little guy. Terrible. 342 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:54,000 Boy, how insecure are we as human beings 343 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,000 putting all our fear on one little guy 344 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,000 and afraid to let him out. 345 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:00,000 He might break all the toys. 346 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:02,000 Why do you say little guy? 347 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:06,000 Because I'm not the guy you're trying to make out of me. 348 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:08,000 That's not me. 349 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,000 I don't know what my way is. 350 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:12,000 Everybody keeps telling me I got all these things. 351 00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:14,000 I read the other day where I had magical powers, 352 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:16,000 and I told everybody in the chapel, 353 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,000 I said, zap, zap, zap, zap. 354 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:20,000 I said, where's my magical powers? 355 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:22,000 Well, you can't read, you can't believe what you read in the press. 356 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:24,000 I can't get no magical powers, 357 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,000 mystical trips, 358 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:28,000 and all that kind of crap. 359 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:32,000 Yeah, it's kind of silly. 360 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:34,000 We got witches and devils, 361 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:36,000 and one guy come up and said, 362 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:38,000 I heard you said you were Jesus. 363 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:40,000 I said, no, man, I ain't said nothing. 364 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:42,000 He said, I'm glad. 365 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:44,000 He said, I'm damn glad. 366 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:46,000 I said, why? 367 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:48,000 He said, I know you ain't here. 368 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,000 I said, how do you know? 369 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:52,000 He said, because I am. 370 00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:54,000 I said, okay. 371 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,000 But I mean, you know, I've been in the Net Ward for 10 years, 372 00:16:56,000 --> 00:17:00,000 so you can't expect me to rationally take this thing serious.