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Hey ladies and gentlemen, welcome back. Thank you for joining us here. Henrik with Red
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Eyes TV. Always a pleasure having you with us. Today we are going to talk about Charles
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Manson, who of course, as you know, died at the age of 83 in prison. He was actually narrowly
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escaping a death sentence, I think a year later. He'd been in prison for one year when California
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actually abolished the death penalty. So he actually lingered for a long time in prison.
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And it could frankly be that if he had died at that point, maybe his martyrdom would have been
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even greater, so to speak. But this is a very interesting story around Manson and who kind of
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basically engineered him, who created him, what is he a product of, and who is behind him, and for
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what purpose. Those are some of the questions that we're going to try to kind of dig deeper into
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today and talk about together with Jay Dyer, who's back on the show. Good to have you here, Jay.
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Always a pleasure. Let's kind of just begin and chit chat a little bit about this, because there's
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many facets, many aspects to Manson and kind of what made him into what he is, of course. But the
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main essence that people should know is that he's not an isolated phenomena that rose out of nowhere.
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He did what he did, and then he vanished. It seems for us who are looking at the evidence,
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if we both are to speak about what we know about him, but also speculate a little bit at the same
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time, that he was a product, if you will, of years of experimentation, things that seems to have been
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initiated actually in London initially. He was dragged into this thing of the process church,
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which had actually earlier roots in London. And then, of course, he transforms with his first,
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I think, when he's in jail for the first time, he joins Scientology, and there's a time between
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Scientology and the process of the church. And at some point, he basically begins to transform into
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this demon, this monster, which manipulates other people to basically do his crime. But how do we
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understand Charles Manson and what he comes out of? What environment?
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You won't understand Manson, buddy. I'll show you Charles Manson. Red eyes and commie, commie
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ice, red commie ice. I got the brain of a child and the fingers of a monster. That's how you
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understand Charles Manson. A lot of mumbo jumbo, in other words. Red commie ice, but...
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You got me popsicle, you got me popsicle, red eyes.
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We're all in on it. He does say that in the interviews. He'll start dancing and he'll say
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that you're all in on it. He's definitely high energy when you look at some of the interviews
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with him, you know? It's huge. High energy. It's gonna be huge.
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But why are people sucked into someone like him then? Why are people, because he's like,
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he's the devil, but he's Jesus, and he's fulfilling all these archetypes where basically
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people are, for some reason, they're drawn to that. They want that. They want to be around that.
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Right? It's been some years since I read in depth into Manson, but I can kind of recall
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roughly what the basic outline was, is that he grew up very poor. I don't think he had a mother,
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or his mother was a prostitute or something of that effect, and he didn't know his father.
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There was a lack of parental guidance, obviously. He ended up in the juvenile delinquent system
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very early for petty crimes. I don't know how true this is, but the story is that when he was in
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Kentucky, if I recall, he would kind of wander around burial mounds. In Kentucky, there's a
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lot of Indian burial mounds. He kind of had this feeling that he was being spoken to by spirits,
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and this kind of stuff. But I think that he was probably just kind of crazy early on due to
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dysfunctional upbringing. Then he gets into the institutional system by the time he's old enough.
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I don't remember what his crimes were. It is there that he's introduced to Scientology,
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at least the story goes. If I recall, he achieved the ThetaClear level, which is,
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I don't know if you know about the Xenu when you're at ThetaClear and the aliens,
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maybe it's right below that level. I don't know. Regardless, the analyses of different people is
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that he seemed to be a different person after this process. There's some speculation that
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he might have been used as an experiment. There actually is documentation in different MKUltra
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books where they would use prison facilities for experimentation. Dr. Ewan Cameron was involved
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in this in psychiatric institutes. Dr. John C. Lilly actually had been reading his book
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about programming with LSD, and he actually was one of the MKUltra doctors. He specifically says
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that the prisons were used. I don't know exactly what prisons were used, but I'm saying that it is
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possible that that's who you're going to experiment on. You're going to experiment on people that
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have signed themselves over to the system. You were talking military people. The military
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owns you. If you are in federal prison, the prison system owns you. The psychiatric system,
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very easy to utilize these people for something like that. Again, I don't know for sure, but this
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is what people have speculated. When he comes out of that prison system, then he wanders to LA and
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is involved in the Laurel Canyon scene, which Dave McGowan's written extensively about. This is
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the hotbed, the Petri dish incubator for the coming hippie revolution. I think that this is
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where he's going to play a central role in being one of these figures, a cult of personality
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figure. This is what you were getting at with the creation of a cult. He is, I believe, a social
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experiment in terms of can we use a shamanic, creepy, weirdo figure to be a cult magnet.
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That's exactly what you see with Manson. He was just briefly from 61 to 1966 at McNeil Island,
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which is in Washington state, one of these penitentiaries. Of course, it's years later
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that he kills Sharon Tate. Again, he apparently didn't do this, but he convinced his family
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members to do this for him. Again, the point is well taken. We don't know what kind of things he
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went through at that point. We don't know what happened with him during his experimentation with
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Scientology and the process and all that stuff. There is some footage. Let's play a little bit
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of that, actually him talking about the process. Let's just listen into this. I was in prison
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when the Dianetics first started. 1950. We fought the establishment. The black Muslims
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were coming in with the Koran on the dark side of the moon and the Islamic arm of the church
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and the Mason area. I don't know how to put the Masons involved in that. I don't want to get
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tripped up with anyone else on any other level. But he came up with Dianetics 1950.
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A lot of the guys were interested in studying the way to process the mind,
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how to clear your mind from past confusion, how to resurrect the soul and be reborn within yourself.
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That's where Scientology started. Then they started selling it. Then it got to be the process.
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Then the church, the last day, the last judgment, I sent some people to England. I couldn't go
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myself, but I sent some people there to do some certain things to make an effect, to cause
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an awakening, an awareness. Bruce was just one person that went in that direction.
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There were some other people riding motorcycles that were doing some other things.
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He goes on. That's interesting. The process of the church, the final judgment, you have people
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like Robert de Grimstone. That's early in the process. They're experimenting with all these
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different ways. As I said, how to take control of the mind or clean the mind. A lot of weird
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stuff. I'm not against this kind of soul experimentation and trying to unlock different
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properties of yourself. You're a geller.
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Bending spoons and all that stuff. It's clear that-
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You bend your Viking swords with your mind.
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I've not been able to do that yet. I can't even bend it with my hands.
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The Grimstone is part of that early process. As you said, he did this in prison and all that
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stuff. Are these the guys we should look at over in London as the precursor to
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what happened in the States later with all these other cults that pop up?
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I recall de Grimstone was a failed Catholic priest. He was considering trying to get into
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the priesthood. I think there was a pederast case, if I recall. I think that's in William
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Kennedy's book, Lucifer's Lodge. He, together with this woman named- What's her name?
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Mary Ann McLean, they create this cult, which is a spinoff of Scientology.
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She is directly connected to a prostitution ring that was associated with British spies
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in terms of the Profumo affair, which is one of the most famous British espionage cases.
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The Mary Ann McLean woman, I think, is very suspicious. With the British spy circles,
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you would have a direct connect to the Tavistock Institute because they were
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specializing in British psychological warfare approaches. They were the ones studying trauma,
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shell shock after World War I, and all the stuff that we talked about a few interviews ago.
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What they did was they kind of put together Mr. Potato Head with a cult, like,
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let's stick a Jesus-looking beard on the guy, let's stick a swastika here,
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let's put Jesus and Satan together, and let's see how that one works, like a test tube.
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I think you're absolutely right to pinpoint the connection to- I had not even seen that clip,
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so that actually backed up my theory that there was a direct connect to London.
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I had no idea Manson talked about that.
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Yep, very interesting, right? And Berkowitz was also part, I think,
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son of Sam, the other killer, he was part of this- I forget the story here, there was-
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yeah, this is detailing some of it on Paranoia Magazine, this article, which is very interesting,
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which goes into the early Scientology connections between the process church of the final judgment
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and the Manson family, you know?
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Yes, there is a thesis that police investigator Mari Terry posed a long time ago in his book,
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Ultimate Evil, that maybe there was something behind not just Manson, but also son of Sam,
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also perhaps Henry Lee Lucas and some of these other cult figures, and famous ritual murders
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that were going on at the time of the explosion of the serial killer phenomenon. It's really
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Manson that kicks this off in the media sphere. I mean, certainly there have been serial killers
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before, but Manson kicks this off in the media sphere to initiate the idea of this serial killer,
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and it's odd because, as you pointed out, Manson himself doesn't actually kill anybody,
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so he's not technically a serial killer. He sends his brainwashed girls, his harem, to do it,
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harem of assassins, at least so the story goes, but what different writers like Mari Terry,
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not just Terry, other people too, have written books on the possibility that the patterns that
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pop up in Son of Sam, and Berkowitz saying that he was actually part of a group called a family
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cult, not the same as Manson, but Manson names it cult. I think I have it at the children.
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Was that what the- That's it, the children.
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The children, right? Yeah. That's it. So there's the children,
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there's Manson's family, you have the zodiac at the same time as all this as well.
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That's right. And a lot of people have pointed out that
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the zodiac seems to bear a lot of stamps of perhaps military intelligence, naval intelligence,
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ONI type stuff. That's again a thesis. Other writers have posited that these might be
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murders that were placed upon certain criminals to kind of just clean up unsolved cases.
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And then certain magazines, certain papers might have cashed in on the fact that, oh,
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now there's this trending topic of the serial killer. Let's create some news stories and
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sensationalism. So all these factors could be involved, but what I'm getting at is that when
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you look at the tendencies of, there's usually some kind of Hollywood connection, there's a
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military intelligence connection, a CIA connection, something like that. There's the usage of drugs
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and brainwashing, MKUltra type stuff just happens to be. There is usually some kind of pedophilia,
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pederasty. Again, look at the children of God cult, right? I mean, this is what
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Rose McGowan, Joaquin Phoenix, River Phoenix, they come out of this cult. This is a pederasty cult
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run by a guy who, again, tries to put on the Jesus mask and pretend he's Jesus and whatnot.
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And it also has these Hollywood connections, right? And it's a commune. So we're starting
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to see this experimentation, this lab experiment in all of these different examples. And the same
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will go for Jim Jones. What does Jim Jones do? He goes down to Brazil and under the cover of
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different NGO type agencies that have for a long time been used by the CIA, like World Vision or
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USAID, they're down there studying the local indigenous religions, the candomblé, the drug
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use by the shamans. And then they come back and they just happen to set up their cults where
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people are drugged. I mean, come on. But the guy he's down there liaisoning with, probably his
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handler is an unknown CIA guy, Dan Mitrione. Yep. It's fascinating. And they know what components
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they need to use, right? They need to play on powerful archetypes. They need to bring in some,
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you know, Christian theology, but spice it up with the devil. Yeah, exactly. A little bit of this,
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a little bit of that, right? And the end result is, of course, that depending on what the outcome
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is, it works. Or I think that they discover that, yes, we can do this. Now, we don't know what the
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goal was. Maybe it was to just murder one and they killed several, or it was just reversed. They
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wanted to try to have him kill 100 and they just did a few. That we don't know. We don't know the
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motivations of what they actually wanted to do. But it's enough of experimentation in social
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engineering for them to realize that they can upset things in this capacity. So what I believe
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happened, Jay, is that what happens with Manson specifically is that when you bring in not only
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the drugs and all that kind of stuff into it, but the combination of what they call the British
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invasion with all the music coming out of tab stock, such as the Beatles and all the stuff.
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I mean, that's really when Manson supposedly goes over the edge. When the Beatles release
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their white album, right? That's when Helter Skelter is on. That's when he gets, I guess,
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all these ideas about a race war and stuff. He interprets it in that way. So something triggers
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in him there and we don't know, is it the music? Is there something in there? Or is that just what
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happens when a guy takes tons of acid and just sees these things in everything and what to do?
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We don't know. We just don't know that. So what you're saying is, has the real Paul McCartney,
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who is it? He's dead, man. He's dead, right? Joke. I don't even I've never even really looked into
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that. But what I'm saying is, yes, you're right that that Beatles have, again, at the same time
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as the British invasion, you have the Crowley and invasion is one thing we could call it.
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Because you mentioned the Scientology and Process Church. What were where did L Ron Hubbard learn
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his cult skills? Where was he before he started the military? Oh, he's called and in the military.
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Yep. So as a follower, Crowley, what I what I think Hubbard did was kind of take the skills
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that he learned there and in naval work that he did and come up with a formula for a cult.
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I think that the same pattern is what happens in the rock bands. So rock bands and rock leaders
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are cults too. And that's what they were studying with Tabistock. That's why the Beatles are hanging
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out with Maharshi Mahesh Yogi is that they're trying to figure out how they can be these icons
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of being a guru. Yeah. Now, what's the point of that was? Yeah, it's the party and get laid. But
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that's not all there is to it. Because there's a lot of money. There's a lot of power and influence
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behind these commodities. And that's what they are. And they're not just commodities to make money.
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They're also agents of change, their cultural transition agents for a purpose. And that's
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precisely why Tabistock comes into play here. And it's not just how stock there's all the
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American analogs for the exact same stuff. Ray and Corporation has for decades studied
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pop culture, how to alter and change things and sell things through pop culture. That's what I
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wrote about in my book. Yeah, and that has been the biggest change agent, if you want to call it
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that has been the method through how they transform from a more conservative family
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oriented culture and the 60s. And that's why this period is so interesting, because it all just
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explodes onto the scene at this point. America won the Second World War, the evil guy, the
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Nazis are gone now. Now we can, you know, let's party now. Let's do all these things and release
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the drugs and do all the stuff. And the reality is that the CIA and these other intelligence
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services have an intricate role in disseminating them and starting the experimentation starting
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and testing, seeing what works and what doesn't work. And I think it's partially also why they
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bring religion into it is to create dedication beyond reason, right? That they need that element
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of faith, they need that element of like something which is simply higher than the material reality
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itself. And that's where that comes in. Yeah, there was a I'm thinking of the the there were
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magazines actually in the 70s, which I didn't know this until very recently, one of them was
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called Star magazine. And what it did in the 70s, early 70s was promote the idea of the groupie.
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So you had one of the predecessors to Manson, Vito Palikas, and Vito was this nutball,
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who oddly enough wasn't pro drugs. And he would actually talk about how the CIA and the government
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use drugs to to mind bomb everybody and to socially engineer, but he's also running his
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cult. So I think he knows what's going on. And he's the beginning of the groupie. He's the beginning
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of the whiskey go go the doors and these different bands are playing and they weren't actually that
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good music wise. So what they had to do to bring in audiences was have a bunch of bare nested babes,
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you know, bouncing around. And that's where Vito came in, is that he would bring his flock of
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runaways in. And so people would go see these concerts, the Mamas and the Papas doors and
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whatnot, because Vito's bare breasted babes were there. And this is actually what got the hippie
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stuff going. This is the guy, by the way, folks, for you watching the video version. That's the guy
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Jay's talking about right there. He sees that he's British, I guess. And he is exactly as you said,
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which is very interesting. He was mentioned that LSD watch out for that kids. It's all government
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and stuff. He seems to be a blueprint of certain aspects of kind of the archetype that they're
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developing, but then they add in their own components later as detailed. Yeah. So after
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him comes Manson and Manson basically mirrors Vito and all these different, you know, cult patterns.
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He's, you know, he's got the harem, he's got the young kids. Vito was an advocate, as I understand,
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of pedophilia. Manson was into that. There's a definite tie into Hollywood. The spawn ranch
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where the family was actually an old movie set. So you have Manson hanging out in the circles of
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Roman Polanski and the circles of the beach boys. You know, he it's all kind of a cauldron there
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from whence this brew spews forward. And what it does is more so than it being, oh, Charles Manson
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is like a mind controlled assassin, which I'm not denying, you know, the horrendous nature of
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the ritual murder. But what I'm getting at is that the real effect of it is culture wide mass
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consciousness. That's the whole purpose of it. Because of what it does is, you know, you'll talk
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to people from that generation that were there and that's, oh, JFK and Manson that destroyed
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America's innocence. Right. And so it did achieve the social engineering trauma factor,
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you know, that it was that was that was trying to go for. So that was the whole point of it.
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And that's why Manson I think is so central is that he's one of these, he's like a sticker,
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like a sticker that you stick on anything that you want to to be basically ruined. Right. So
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early on, early on, I do think that there were I'm not a leftist, but I do think there were some
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people who were genuinely anti war. And then they were trying to do this through their music.
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And so what they would do is with any of these Laurel Canyon creepers, you know, weirdos,
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John Phillips, you know, mamas and papas, and Frank Zappa, and these kind of people is that
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they would pick out who were the real anti war people. And what they would do is they would
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thrust to the forefront somebody who was just a total hedonistic, Dionysian degenerate like Jim
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Morrison. And so what they could do is with Manson is that any anything that you want to
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taint to make look funky and nasty is you just stick the Manson sticker on it. Oh,
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Charles Manson talks about, you know, stopping the war. Oh, you're like Manson, you don't think that
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these wars are good. You see what I'm saying? And that's a very powerful, you know,
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disinformation tactic that's gone on for a long time. Oh, you talk about race. Oh, you're like
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that Manson guy, you can get to put the Manson sticker on. And that's literally happened just
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in the last few days, right? That everyone is latching onto this guy and trying to prove that
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their enemies is like Manson. So what some of the earlier stuff that was done by people is that
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while Manson was there to make the hippie movement seem ridiculous and silly, and as you say,
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maybe that was true in the beginning, in the initial stages of it. Yeah, sure. I would agree
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with that. Here's a classic headline, you know, that those people have found CIA documents and
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supposedly they say, you know, the hippie movement is too influential, it's changing people's
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perception on the Vietnam War. But what the CIA did is instead of killing it was to take it over,
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merge with it and control it and take it in a different direction and stuff like that.
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But later, as you say, and this is evidence because it's happened in the last couple of days,
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is that they take it into this direction where basically, no, actually, Charles Manson was a
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white supremacist, right? With the Helter Skelter and with his swastika. But as I said earlier,
24:18.520 --> 24:24.040
when we spoke, he initially had an X in his forehead and that he converted that later over
24:24.040 --> 24:28.520
to a swastika, meaning someone is literally handling this guy and just telling him, no, no,
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go in this direction now, do this. But he would have made the X-Men look bad and the X-Men,
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the X-Men are an image of gay rights. So. Oh, there you go. Exactly. Well, so, you know,
24:37.400 --> 24:43.720
here's a video playing here where basically the discredited publication Newsweek connects Manson to
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the alt-right. You know, today the alt-right has adopted some ideas of his white supremacist. I
24:49.720 --> 24:53.880
mean, it's like so predictable. They even went further, by the way, just because of the fact
24:53.880 --> 24:58.600
that they talk about race, right? They have to be Charles Manson. But Fox News had a detail here
24:58.600 --> 25:03.880
of how one of their authors also connected it to Trump, right? He's Trump. You know, that's like
25:03.880 --> 25:10.840
brilliant. You know, and that's, that's what it's gonna be. Charlie, good friend, great guy,
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gonna be huge. It's ridiculous. I mean, Newsweek is tanking. We know it's fake news. It's all
25:17.400 --> 25:22.120
bullshit. But, you know, for a little while it works, you know, it works for a little while. So
25:22.840 --> 25:27.080
how do we deconstruct that? That they use it in whatever way they want to. They just,
25:27.080 --> 25:33.000
they create these, you know, demons and people's champions and they just steer it off in whatever
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direction they want. But seeing through it is what helps, Jake, seeing what they're doing.
25:40.280 --> 25:45.800
Yeah. I mean, if you look at the Laurel Canyon scene, and I don't mean to dwell on this too
25:45.800 --> 25:50.920
much, but it's very illustrative. You have not just the creation of this
25:50.920 --> 25:57.240
burgeoning counterculture music movement, which again, I think there were a lot of sincere artists
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and musicians who they, I mean, I'm not saying they were geniuses, but they probably just didn't
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like the idea of constant wars. What's the point of all this? And so what you have is you have
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a bunch of families and military intelligence people, and it's their kids who are the ones
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that are thrust into stardom. You know, Jim Morrison's dad is an admiral. He's involved
26:17.640 --> 26:22.920
directly in the Gulf of Tonkin incident. This is public history, but Jim Morrison would never
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talk about that. Jim Morrison would always say, Oh, my dad's dead. His dad wasn't dead. His dad was
26:28.760 --> 26:36.280
an admiral. So why is it that Jim Morrison is suddenly the image of this music scene,
26:36.280 --> 26:41.560
this burgeoning culture creation scene? Well, it's because Jim Morrison is not just a kind
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of a nutball, but he promotes a lot of degeneracy. I mean, you watch old videos of Jim Morrison and
26:48.520 --> 26:56.360
he's he's humping the speaker on stage and, you know, pulling his wanker out. He's opening the door.
26:58.280 --> 27:01.960
He's breaking on to the through to the other side. That's right. Lighting it on fire.
27:02.360 --> 27:08.280
Yeah. And so what I'm getting at is that these characters,
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it's I don't think that it's accidental that they were actually supported by the establishment. So
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like Atlantic Records, who was at this time, if I recall, run by a Turkish guy who was connected
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to some intelligence group, like Turkish intelligence at this time, and he somehow becomes
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the owner of Atlantic, right? What they promote, like all these counterculture people. Now, why
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would Atlantic Records, AM radio rolling all the big magazines at the time? I don't know if
27:36.680 --> 27:39.960
Rolling Stone was out then, but all the big magazines at the time start promoting all these
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counterculture people who don't have any real philosophy or political bent. They're just
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Dionysian hedonists. And the point is that if they were truly countercultural,
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they would not be promoted by all of these mainstream establishment,
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promotional figures, Time Magazine. That's another one of the big ones that promoted
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all these guys is Time Magazine. And that's because, by the way, Henry Luce, who owned
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Time Magazine, it's called bonus guy, Henry Luce and his wife, Claire Booth Luce, were very big in
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promoting LSD. They would actually they actually promoted it on the cover of some Time Magazine
28:18.520 --> 28:24.360
issues back at the time. And that's because they were connected to Gordon Watson, who went down to
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Latin and Central America. Carlos Castaneda was part of this too, by the way. And they were
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studying the indigenous religions to create the mind control shaman. So what you're looking at in
28:35.240 --> 28:40.440
these nutballs is versions of mind control shaman. Jim Morrison would talk about himself like that,
28:40.440 --> 28:44.200
like he was the shaman figure. Yeah, the kind of a witch doctor,
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Dionysian almost, yeah, Loki type. You don't know if they're good or they evil, but that see those
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properties, I think, draw people into it as well. Because you can read everything.
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Oh, he's so deep. He does poetry on stage and he talks about-
28:56.600 --> 28:59.880
You need to decode it. And what is it? And then he was like, well, there's nothing there.
28:59.880 --> 29:01.000
You know, it's like, it's bullshit.
29:01.000 --> 29:06.760
The snake is on the lake, taking a break.
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The lizard king, you know, yeah. It goes on, you know.
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But one of the things too that's interesting that I wanted to talk a little bit about
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is that there is these weird connections kind of at the time as well that, you know,
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different aspects that kind of flow into each other. For example, right, let's talk about,
29:27.240 --> 29:33.800
I guess the Dakota building in New York is a central piece in this because it was, you know,
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John Lennon, he had an apartment in the Dakota. Mark David Chapman, who shot Lennon, he was,
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he shot him outside of the Dakota building, right? In the building at the time is where they shot
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Rosemary's baby, which is basically about, you know, Satan's son incarnate coming to earth
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shot by Roman Polanski.
29:51.720 --> 29:57.880
Roman Polanski, exactly, which is married to Sharon Tate, who's murdered by the Manson family
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and the clan and the family and all that stuff. And so that's just one of these like weird kind
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of coincidences that just where everything kind of ties in together. I don't know if there's any
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thought behind this or if that's just what happened at the time, but there's many of these,
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many kind of weird, weird things like that, where it seems that someone is almost like pulling the
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string kind of behind the scenes. And Chapman, of course, Mark David Chapman was the guy who
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read the Catcher in the Rise, Salinger has all these connections to also to the intelligence
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services and stuff like that. There's a movie called Chapter 27, which is pretty interesting
30:33.960 --> 30:39.320
that details that. And 27, it's the age of where all these pop stars die at, by the way, the 27
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club, you know, so there's all these weird synchronicities and kind of occult connections.
30:43.240 --> 30:47.240
What do you make of that? Yeah, I think you're right. In fact, when you look into Mark David
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Chapman, he thought he was obsessed with Wizard of Oz and he would, he would read everything in the
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Wizard of Oz kind of mythos, which again does actually pop up at times in MKLTRA mind control
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stuff. I was finally able to verify one aspect of that word. Dr. Ewan Cameron actually did
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use the Wizard of Oz in a lot of his LSD reprogramming tests. And he had convinced this
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one woman through electroshock and through the administration of so much LSD that she thought
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she was Alice in, you know, in the rabbit hole or whatever. So there were actual connections. That's
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not just a conspiracy myth. There is one that's in Search for the Man's Sharing Candidate. John
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Marks details that experiment. So what I'm getting at is that I don't know if
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Mark David Chapman was for sure, you know, in part of some MKLTRA program, but he was, as you said,
31:42.760 --> 31:49.400
in these bizarre evangelical groups for a time, which those have, there's confirmation. Many of
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those have been created by Pentagon and military intelligence for different kinds of experimentations.
31:54.280 --> 31:59.960
Berkowitz was for a time involved in one of these evangelical groups right after he joined
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the military. With Chapman, it's not just the question of the Wizard of Oz. He actually had
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delusions where he thought that he was interacting with the little people, the munchkins from the
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Wizard of Oz. I'm not joking from the Wizard of Oz. And so why that's relevant is that a guy like
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that with those kinds of delusions could easily be fingered and profiled and picked to be part of
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some kind of operation like this. In other words, when these people go through these kinds of
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military or institutional settings, psychiatric settings, the system, they're profiled and people
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know who the nuts are. And these wackos can actually serve a very useful purpose if you're
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running covert operations or black operations, because you can just pin whatever you're doing
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on some wacko. I'm not saying that makes John Lennon a hero. In fact, the whole thing kind
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of propels John Lennon into superstardom. So it could be that this makes a martyr out of John
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Lennon and the left. But, and again, I don't claim to know. I'm looking at both possibilities. You
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also have John Lennon towards the end of his life coming out and saying, hey man, did you know,
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I've been looking into the conspiracy. They're going to kill everyone, man.
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Does the conspiracy to kill the villain. So maybe they didn't like him talking about,
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you know, radical depopulation agenda, or maybe, you know, the so-called assassination was just
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a way to propel him into being a martyr. And a lot of these rock stars in the 27 Club that you're
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talking about, martyred rock stars or dead rock stars actually propels the mythology.
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Much more powerful, much more. They basically can't put their foot in their mouth
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too much at some point. Right. So again, people see them as these literally as these heroes. So
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it could also probably be this issue that, you know, there might be somewhat control in the
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early stages. It's not really that they don't have that much of a, how do I put it, content
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or direction in like an ideology that they are pushing. But later, if they do wake up to some
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of this stuff, or even how the inside operatives work of entertainment and stuff like that,
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it's very beneficial to take them out at that point. And they end up making more money on them.
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They can turn them into these martyrs, as you say. And it's before they basically started
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spreading any truly dangerous ideas, truly countercultural ideas in the world.
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Well, a great example is Elvis himself. Elvis was into theosophy and all this weird stuff.
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And Elvis became convinced, and his manager was military intelligence, by the way.
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Look, his manager was a general. That is true. That is true.
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And so Elvis starts thinking he's Jesus, and he calls his managers and people
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apostles. I mean, Elvis kind of went nuts and, you know, no telling what drugs he was on, too.
34:53.480 --> 34:58.360
So but he but Elvis was a he's kind of the real icon, I guess you could say,
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of the culture creation, a mythos, right? Marilyn Monroe is another one of these,
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and she's important for transformations of views of sexuality. Then then we have the next phase,
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which is like the Manson type, right? Which is even more bizarre and degenerate.
35:15.160 --> 35:20.360
Yeah, exactly. And it's what do you think that they're using this for? I mean, if you just look
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at Manson specifically, I mean, it might have just as you say, it might just have been the petri dish
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that was the objective, the experiment in itself, it might not be that it needed to serve something
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today that can use as we as we pointed out, as a very important battering ram against any kind of
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movement or you know, whatever you need to basically. So it serves a purpose. But is there
35:40.680 --> 35:46.760
any deeper like is there any is there any ritualistic nature to this occult nature,
35:46.760 --> 35:53.800
which they somehow think they tap into or you can utilize? I would say yes, that's very likely
35:53.800 --> 35:58.280
because some of the people that we mentioned in the background, Robert D. Grimston, you know,
35:58.280 --> 36:05.560
these are people who actually were for a time, very interested in black magic in sorcery, the
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dark side of the occult and all that. So I think he may have been a handler, I don't know. But
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but I mean, that guy's into some really dark stuff. And you do have people in the background
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of the these kinds of operations usually who usually are into the occult, you know, there's
36:21.240 --> 36:27.640
there's obviously some cult aspect to the zodiac killings. If you look at Henry Lee Lucas,
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Henry Lee Lucas claimed to have been part of the hand of death cult down near the border of
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Texas and Mexico. And it was later discovered that there actually was a kind of cult compound
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there and that people were being human, there was human trafficking going on and this kind of stuff.
36:45.320 --> 36:50.360
So I'm not saying that makes Henry Lucas innocent. I don't know actually know what's going on. But
36:50.360 --> 36:55.160
what I'm saying is that he served a function, most likely as a kind of maybe a hitman or something
36:55.160 --> 37:03.640
like that. But in many of these cases of these so called killer serial killers, that Manson, etc,
37:03.640 --> 37:09.640
there's absolutely an occult, dark occult ritual aspect to them. And I mean, that goes all the way
37:09.640 --> 37:15.000
back to like the black Dahlia case, which is quite obviously a ritual murder. Let's get into a little
37:15.000 --> 37:19.080
bit. But before we do that, let's just talk about this proto you found a case I had never heard of
37:19.080 --> 37:24.840
it, which was kind of a precursor to Manson and many of these others, LA Weekly did an expose on
37:24.840 --> 37:31.640
this another suicide bomb cult, I guess 1950s. That's early. They even have actually the one
37:31.640 --> 37:35.320
interesting note I saw right away is that you see in the backdrop on the door there, they have
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like a Templar cross. And there's another image here a little bit further down in the article where
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you can see on her kind of chest there she has the Templar cross and the process church kind of has
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the Templar cross but twisted all the arms are twisted and it makes it you know, look like a
37:51.480 --> 37:56.040
swastika, which of course Manson shows up on his forehead with eventually too. But tell us about
37:56.120 --> 38:03.160
this other cult, Jay. Right. This is interesting because you have this guy who also was former
38:03.160 --> 38:09.320
military, I forget what his role was. I don't think it was military intelligence, but he starts
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calling himself Krishna Venta. And he starts this cult and quite like right away. What's weird about
38:17.560 --> 38:26.680
this cult is that they're in the news at the scene of a famous plane wreck. Now they just
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happened to be on the scene to give all the plane wreck people aid, I guess many of them survived.
38:33.880 --> 38:38.840
Some of them were actually famous Hollywood people, very bizarre story. And but what this
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did was propel the cult to give them a lot of advertising. So I don't I mean, this didn't
38:43.720 --> 38:49.800
become like a nationwide cult. It's one of these very specific, unique to California cults. And
38:51.320 --> 38:55.720
you know, there's all the typical cult stuff, the guy looks like Jesus, surprise, surprise.
38:56.520 --> 39:01.240
And, you know, you've got young kids and brainwashing and all that kind of stuff. And oh,
39:01.240 --> 39:08.680
you got to give the cult all your money. And then what happens is, they are involved in
39:08.680 --> 39:15.240
a suicide bombing plot, which is very bizarre, which I don't doesn't actually happen. But this
39:15.240 --> 39:21.560
foils the cult. And it goes under. But what's interesting is that yes, this is another guy
39:21.560 --> 39:29.320
who's a proto Manson. This is prior to veto veto pollicus, another proto Manson cult. Again, very
39:29.320 --> 39:37.800
mixed up in big mainstream media stories given press coverage. And then this shady plot of suicide
39:38.680 --> 39:44.280
bombing that ends the cult. Very, very bizarre. Again, like you, I'd only learned about this in
39:44.280 --> 39:48.280
the last couple weeks. So I'm not any kind of expert on it. But but but even LA Weekly says,
39:48.280 --> 39:53.560
Hey, there seems to be a pattern here. Right? So it's not just crazy conspiracy theorists that are
39:53.560 --> 39:59.720
making the connections and seeing these patterns between how a lot of these cults seem to have
39:59.720 --> 40:04.920
something else going on beyond just what they appear to be, which I would say is probably some
40:04.920 --> 40:09.560
kind of social engineering or intelligence function. So there's been different incarnations
40:09.560 --> 40:13.880
of this where they basically are successful, if you will, in some cases, and less successful
40:13.880 --> 40:19.080
in others. And there is a kind of a progression basically, where they, but the epicenter seems
40:19.080 --> 40:24.600
to be California, it seems to be, you know, this particular area for, for some reason, I don't I
40:24.600 --> 40:30.280
don't know, it just, what about the lookout mountain stuff? Tell us a little bit about that.
40:30.360 --> 40:36.840
Well, I can tell you my, my theory is because California is kind of as a whole, basically,
40:36.840 --> 40:42.520
a military industrial complex state. I mean, there are hidden bases, there's more bases,
40:42.520 --> 40:48.360
and there's secret Navy Seal bases. I mean, I, my dad was the military, he was stationed in San
40:48.360 --> 40:53.720
Diego. So I know about this. And a lot of this is public. I'm not saying anything secret, you can
40:53.720 --> 41:01.320
look up all the naval bases in San Diego. And so and it is a hotbed of the creation of the cult,
41:02.040 --> 41:07.400
the alternative lifestyle. This was advertised back, you know, 50s and 60s, come to LA,
41:07.960 --> 41:14.440
you know, there's a great scene at the beginning of LA confidential, where Danny DeVito is
41:14.440 --> 41:19.960
actually reading out some sort of promo for like coming to LA. And what they were doing was trying
41:19.960 --> 41:24.680
to sell people on move out here and all your dreams will come true, you know, you'll be a
41:24.680 --> 41:31.320
famous star or whatever. And then LA confidential actually kept that's a good movie that actually
41:31.320 --> 41:35.560
encapsulates kind of what we're talking about here a little bit prior to the cult phenomenon,
41:35.560 --> 41:40.040
this 50s 40s. Could it be that it attracts a certain individual, sorry to interrupt you,
41:40.040 --> 41:45.800
but one who's basically as a willing to kind of leave that maybe they don't they don't have those
41:45.800 --> 41:50.440
strong roots to a certain extent for some reason, right, so that they're willing to uproot and go.
41:50.440 --> 41:56.120
And those who are probably be more successful, susceptible to being swept into whatever they're
41:56.120 --> 42:00.040
part of, whether that's a movie industry around Hollywood, or whether that's some of this military
42:00.040 --> 42:05.560
stuff or some of the occult things going on. Oh, you're spot on. Yeah, I mean, the I mean,
42:05.560 --> 42:10.120
who's gonna do this? Well, the person who thinks they're going to be a movie star, right? Yeah,
42:10.120 --> 42:14.920
I mean, Charles Manson thinks he's going to be a rock star. Yeah, he gets out to to LA to the
42:14.920 --> 42:21.800
Laurel Canyon scene. You know, this is kind of the point of David Lynch's movies, Lost Highway
42:21.800 --> 42:28.920
and Mahalan Drive is it's about, you know, the young girl who goes out to LA, Hollywood, and
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ends up in porn or ends up a crack whore. Yeah. Yeah. And then that's the point or and then yeah,
42:34.760 --> 42:41.400
or you're in a cult, you end up in some crazy, crazy cult. And you're, you know, signing over
42:41.400 --> 42:47.240
your inheritance to some guy that looks like Charles Manson. So I'm glad you mentioned Laurel
42:47.240 --> 42:52.360
Canyon scene, though, because what this shows is that the Air Force had a secret studio.
42:54.040 --> 42:59.720
And then eventually, it would be the CIA before it was sold off, where they were processing and
42:59.720 --> 43:04.280
working in the latest film technologies. So this is like cutting it, this is like the cutting edge
43:05.320 --> 43:10.120
industrial light magic Lucasfilm of its day where they're there. And it's 100% totally
43:10.120 --> 43:14.760
military industrial complex operation. This is where actually the atomic bomb footage was
43:15.560 --> 43:23.080
souped up at the Laurel Canyon studios. It was a giant facility. And all of the A-listers of the
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time, 50s and 60s actually had access to the studio. So you can actually find in that clip
43:29.720 --> 43:33.880
that we're about to see here, you're going to see Jimmy Stewart is there at Lookout Mountain
43:33.880 --> 43:38.840
Studios, filming different kinds of government promos and propaganda type videos. Yeah.
43:40.280 --> 43:45.800
And a lot of the A-listers Walt Disney did a lot of work at Lookout Mountain Studios,
43:45.800 --> 43:51.960
Marilyn Monroe, Cary Grant. And the point is that there's Jimmy Stewart, there's Jimmy Storra,
43:52.840 --> 43:58.920
worship of America, they're gonna fight the comics. Jimmy Storra was actually a
44:00.040 --> 44:05.720
informant. He was an informant for the FBI. He's also in a movie called the FBI story,
44:05.720 --> 44:13.560
which is about the FBI. And Cary Grant also spied for I believe the OSS. And he tried to
44:13.560 --> 44:18.920
out Errol Flynn as a Nazi. Did you know that? I did not know that. Yeah. Good on you, Errol Flynn.
44:20.440 --> 44:26.760
The crazy story, but I think it's probably true. I mean, like the Jimmy Stewart stuff is obvious.
44:26.760 --> 44:32.600
He's in the FBI movie with with J. Edgar Hoover, by the way. Yeah. Anyway, so the point of all
44:32.600 --> 44:39.320
this is that what this shows is that the thesis about Laurel Canyon and Lookout Mountain Studios
44:39.960 --> 44:46.360
is not conspiracy theory or made up. I mean, you're watching them filming war propaganda footage
44:46.360 --> 44:54.360
there. So there was absolutely a 100% military industrial complex connection to the Laurel Canyon
44:54.360 --> 45:00.200
Hollywood scene. And all the A-listers, all the big people are there making movies there.
45:00.280 --> 45:06.920
Interesting. And this was converted over later to a mansion house, which the guy who played Mark
45:06.920 --> 45:14.440
David Chapman, Jared Leto, right? Jared Leto. Yeah, a couple summers ago, I went to LA and I
45:14.440 --> 45:19.000
went and drove. You can't actually go on the property, but you can drive up to Wonderland
45:19.000 --> 45:23.800
Avenue of all roads. You have to get on the Holland Drive. Yeah. And then you get onto
45:23.800 --> 45:27.960
Wonderland Avenue and you drive up there and you can still see some of the old
45:28.760 --> 45:35.080
memorabilia and signs from the Air Force. Stuff is still there. But no, it's like a private
45:35.080 --> 45:40.040
residence. So it's not like you can't go inside or anything. Yeah. So there was an interesting
45:41.800 --> 45:48.360
series of facts when you look into the Lookout Mountain Studio that again,
45:49.080 --> 45:53.400
not many people have been made aware of until Dave wrote Weird Scenes of the Canyon.
45:54.040 --> 46:02.920
And what he documented was that by 1947, the facility was 100,000 square feet. It had sound
46:02.920 --> 46:07.800
stages, screening rooms, film processing labs, editing facilities, animation department,
46:07.800 --> 46:13.960
17 climate control vaults, helicopter pad and a bomb shelter. It produced 19,000 classified
46:13.960 --> 46:18.920
motion pictures, more than all the Hollywood Studio system combined at that time.
46:19.080 --> 46:24.360
Officially, the facility was run by the US Air Force and also produced the Atomic Energy
46:24.360 --> 46:29.800
Commission footage of the atomic and nuclear bomb tests. And then he goes on to say that 3D
46:29.800 --> 46:35.880
effects were developed here, apparently, and Hollywood luminaries such as John Ford, Jimmy
46:35.880 --> 46:41.640
Stewart, Howard Hawks, Ronald Reagan, Bing Crosby, Walt Disney, had a Hopper, Marilyn Monroe,
46:42.360 --> 46:47.560
were all given full clearance to the facility and worked on undisclosed projects. It was
46:47.560 --> 46:53.800
retained as many as 250 producers, directors, technicians, editors, animators, civilian and
46:53.800 --> 47:01.080
military along with top security clearances. So what's fascinating is that this has been going on
47:01.080 --> 47:09.080
this whole time. And that shows that this is a military industrial complex state. The rise of
47:09.080 --> 47:17.320
Hollywood itself is intimately connected to the support and collusion with this kind of stuff,
47:17.320 --> 47:20.840
with the military industrial complex. There's Bob Hope with this. Was it the USO
47:20.840 --> 47:25.400
band? Arm band he had on there or something? Yeah. So there's other aspects going on here
47:25.400 --> 47:29.720
at the time. Of course, there's a subculture kind of in Hollywood. You have some of the,
47:29.720 --> 47:34.440
you know, the Satanist, the kind of this, I mean, they're kind of poster boy Satanist, Kenneth Anger
47:34.440 --> 47:39.880
and LeVay and all these people that are kind of tied somewhat tied into this as well. Some of
47:39.880 --> 47:44.680
the film stars are hanging around these people. They're kind of getting some of their more edgy,
47:44.680 --> 47:50.520
edgy ideas, I guess, from some of these guys. How serious is this in terms of the Satanism
47:50.520 --> 47:55.080
accusations and that these people are into that kind of stuff? Well, again, that's a great point
47:55.080 --> 48:01.480
because this is a cult more or less that comes out of California, right? I mean, modern, the church
48:01.480 --> 48:09.000
of Satan, Anton LeVay, you know, this comes out of California, San Francisco. And I don't think that
48:09.960 --> 48:14.920
that's that church itself is that big of a deal per se. But I think that it is just
48:14.920 --> 48:21.480
another one of the examples of many, many cults that were started that do have high level,
48:21.480 --> 48:26.200
you know, connections. Obviously, there were many, you know, big A-listers that were involved in the
48:26.200 --> 48:32.280
Church of Satan, Sammy Davis Jr. and Jane Mansfield, for example. And some weird things happened with
48:32.280 --> 48:38.840
that kind of stuff. You know, Jane Mansfield has her bad luck car wreck, right? So, you know,
48:40.200 --> 48:44.600
a lot of weird things going on there. I do some people have made a connection between
48:44.600 --> 48:50.200
intelligence agencies and the Church of Satan. I'm not sure if that's true or not. But when we
48:50.200 --> 48:54.120
look at somebody like Michael Aquino, there's obviously a connection and he splits off of the
48:54.120 --> 49:00.520
church, you know, Church of Satan, this arts, a temple set, and then is a fairly prominent colonel
49:00.520 --> 49:04.040
who specializes in psychological warfare. And then you have, you know, you have the
49:04.680 --> 49:09.640
Kenneth Angers, Hollywood Babylon, Lucifer Rising, and all that kind of stuff. I mean, it's that
49:10.920 --> 49:16.600
that's a subculture that seems to exist within Hollywood. But it's influential. And that's
49:17.320 --> 49:25.000
the thing is that even though Kenneth Angers movies are awful and not that great, but they
49:25.000 --> 49:31.400
because they were perceived as edgy at the time, they influenced people later on to do more. I
49:31.400 --> 49:35.000
mean, in other words, it's kind of a pushing the envelope type of thing. I mean, yeah, exactly.
49:35.000 --> 49:39.320
And that's a good point. I mean, is and that might be just the reason to why we see so much of that
49:39.320 --> 49:44.520
now, especially in the music videos, they just all incorporate that and all the personally,
49:44.520 --> 49:48.920
I'm part of also thinking that it is for the sensationalism value to it that he does, you know,
49:48.920 --> 49:52.440
it generates clicks and views and money and all that kind of stuff. But there's something to it
49:52.440 --> 49:59.560
that they're that they're just drawn to. And I think also that it works and it it's successful
49:59.560 --> 50:05.800
to a certain extent to draw people's attention in because these are, you know, old ritualistic
50:06.680 --> 50:11.640
aspects and symbols and talismans and, you know, powerful things that they're using in their
50:11.640 --> 50:16.360
imagery. And I think that that on some level that that speaks to the subconscious of man for some
50:16.360 --> 50:20.440
reason. I think you're right. I think that's kind of the point. The pattern that we've been seeing
50:20.440 --> 50:25.000
here is that what you see with the movie director and with the production of a film,
50:25.800 --> 50:29.960
that's a kind of what in sociology is called. It's a kind of dramaturgy,
50:30.680 --> 50:35.160
a kind of liturgy drama acted, played out. This is the history of
50:36.520 --> 50:41.320
Sophocles, the plays, the Greek plays, the dramas. They're they're a form of ritual
50:42.360 --> 50:49.000
and they are used for the promotion of an idea or an ideology, whether the people in the crowd
50:49.000 --> 50:55.000
know it or not, it is being used in that way. Not everything, but, you know, certainly Greek dramas
50:55.560 --> 51:02.360
were used for the promotion of the ideas of the Greek state or Athens or wherever the plays might
51:02.360 --> 51:07.320
be going on. You know, Virgil does this with the Aeneid. He promotes the the Roman state ideology
51:07.320 --> 51:13.000
through the Aeneid. So this is as old as time. And what I think is so bizarre is that it's just
51:13.000 --> 51:17.320
that when you look at this kind of anger stuff, it's just it's like another level of degenerate.
51:17.400 --> 51:24.440
It's very, very disgusting. But it's relevant because, you know, he has there you go,
51:24.440 --> 51:28.440
Marianne Faithfull, right? He's in circles of Rolling Stones, he's in the circles of the Beatles
51:29.080 --> 51:34.760
and he's putting, you know, Sharon Tate in his movie. I think she's in Lucifer Rising or one of
51:36.760 --> 51:39.960
the occult ones or maybe Marianne Faithfull's in that one. I can't remember, but Sharon Tate's
51:39.960 --> 51:44.440
in one of them and soon after she ends up dead. Yeah, so there's something too. What was that
51:44.440 --> 51:49.720
other one called Mountain, Sacred Mountain? You know, talking about that. Well, John Orowski has
51:49.720 --> 51:53.800
Holy Mountain. Holy Mountain. Maybe that's the one. Yeah, very weird and stuff. But it's all this
51:53.800 --> 51:59.320
kind of pseudo masonic kind of stuff. And we heard Manson earlier, he didn't want to imply them in
51:59.320 --> 52:03.480
anything. But he knew he was aware at that point that, you know, we do move in those circles,
52:03.480 --> 52:10.360
specifically probably in L.A. of Scientology, Freemasonry, you know, the subcultures is all
52:10.360 --> 52:15.160
part of it. And Satanism is there as another flavor for those who favor that, I guess.
52:15.800 --> 52:20.680
I think what you have with subcultures, and there's actually a lot of things that back this up,
52:20.680 --> 52:25.400
it's not just speculation, but what you have with subcultures is again, kind of a test tube,
52:25.400 --> 52:32.600
kind of a Petri dish, and they might allow or fund or get things going. A great example of this is
52:32.600 --> 52:37.320
also the history of punk rock. You can look at some of the interviews I've done with a
52:38.200 --> 52:44.040
couple of guys, John Adams and a guy named Nino, where we they're big fans of the history of
52:44.040 --> 52:48.440
punk rock. And it was the exact same thing where you had kind of had the CIA in the background
52:49.000 --> 52:55.000
funding and putting money into different types of movements, just in subcultures to see what
52:55.000 --> 52:59.880
would happen. You find the same trend in the background of grunge music. Actually, this ties
52:59.880 --> 53:04.840
into, you know, the death of Kurt Cobain. And I'm not trying to take a side on like
53:05.320 --> 53:11.160
being a big fan of Kurt Cobain. I do think he was probably killed. But I don't really care
53:11.160 --> 53:19.880
for the grunge music is what I'm trying to say. But you do have definite selection by powerful
53:19.880 --> 53:26.680
individuals to promote different subcultures. And I think not all the time, I'm not saying every
53:26.680 --> 53:32.040
single thing is controlled, but I'm saying that you can find specific evidence where this kind of
53:32.040 --> 53:38.040
stuff does change culture. Now, if anybody's skeptical, I would just this last week was
53:38.040 --> 53:42.920
reading an interview with Heidi Fleiss of all people. And this was an interview from a few
53:42.920 --> 53:47.320
years ago from somebody's book, I don't remember the name of it. But you can Google for interviews
53:47.320 --> 53:53.560
with Heidi Fleiss and find it. And what she says in that interview is that she realizes that she
53:53.560 --> 54:01.800
herself was a tool of cultural change. Now, I'm not saying that everything with Heidi Fleiss was
54:01.800 --> 54:10.360
planned. But I'm saying that she says, I realized that I was part of the normalization of the idea
54:10.360 --> 54:18.040
and I want to cheating. And then she goes on to say, and it from me, you got the movement to
54:18.120 --> 54:24.200
the idea of reality TV. Right? Yes, that's it. Yeah, it's that vice versa. At the end of that
54:24.200 --> 54:32.280
interview, she says that I was part of cultural mass change and cultural perception. Yeah,
54:32.280 --> 54:36.200
yeah. It's interesting. So if Heidi Fleiss knows that, if Heidi Fleiss knows that,
54:36.200 --> 54:41.080
don't you think social engineers know those things? Yeah, exactly. And the reason, of course, why they
54:42.120 --> 54:45.160
and you say it doesn't mean that every little movement and everything is controlled, but it
54:45.160 --> 54:51.720
means that they seek to have a finger in as many pies as possible, because you don't know which
54:51.720 --> 54:55.720
flavor of pie the public is going to like. And when that reveals itself, you want to make sure
54:55.720 --> 54:59.080
that you're there and part of that group and organization. And that's just how it goes.
54:59.080 --> 55:03.160
And that's true for anything like the stock market or whatever. You diversify your-
55:03.160 --> 55:07.880
But this is what the CIA and MI6 have done this, for example, in the history of,
55:07.880 --> 55:13.000
in Stephen Dorrell's MI6 book, he says that what they would do is they wouldn't have to necessarily
55:13.000 --> 55:17.160
control every single political candidate, it was that they would look and to see where the wind is
55:17.160 --> 55:23.480
blowing. And if some political group was trying to enact a coup in some foreign country, all British
55:23.480 --> 55:28.120
intelligence had to do was try to get the guy who was like the number one guy in that group and make
55:28.120 --> 55:32.680
sure he's your man. You don't have to control everything. If it looks like that group is going
55:32.680 --> 55:39.000
to come to power, just get their rock star. Yeah, global cultural shift, she mentions, I think,
55:39.400 --> 55:44.120
in the interview there too. Yeah, exactly. It was very interesting. And again, this is the stuff
55:44.120 --> 55:48.600
that we've been talking about, that we have engineers, social engineering ongoing to transform
55:49.160 --> 55:54.920
the world. Basically, what people need to understand is that these are tools and things
55:54.920 --> 55:59.960
that they use to transform and shape the world into their image. Ultimately, if you want to create
56:01.000 --> 56:05.960
docile, controllable individuals, you're not just going to be able to overturn all of this
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in one generation or in one go. You need to have various different stages of this. And you want
56:11.640 --> 56:17.880
people to almost want to have these changes. They want to be excited about this. They want to,
56:17.880 --> 56:22.040
as Aldous Huckley said, that you learn to love your servitude. And that's what pop culture
56:22.040 --> 56:28.280
ultimately is. Yeah, the idea of agents of change is very real. And who are the agents of change?
56:28.840 --> 56:37.560
Is it all just Barack Obama's? No, it's people in pop culture. Pop culture has a lot more power
56:38.120 --> 56:43.400
than some government official or bureaucrat. Now, Obama actually was kind of a pop culture
56:43.400 --> 56:49.240
figure too. So it worked for both government and pop culture with Obama. But that's gone on
56:49.240 --> 56:54.920
for a long time too. I mean, Reagan goes from Hollywood to presidency. No surprise there.
56:54.920 --> 57:01.720
But what I'm saying is that you're absolutely right that there's a there's a there's a it's
57:01.720 --> 57:06.760
all about understanding the creation of an image. And this is where we get into the Bernays type.
57:06.760 --> 57:13.240
So this is what Bernays studied for the Department of Defense. Bernays was for a while working at,
57:13.240 --> 57:17.480
you know, the the War Department, which he renamed the Department of Defense. It's more powerful
57:18.360 --> 57:24.520
to be able to figure out how to sell ideas like war. And then you watch a movie like Wag the Dog.
57:24.520 --> 57:30.600
And that's a big part of that movie is selling a war through Willie Nelson songs. Right? If you
57:30.600 --> 57:37.240
remember the plot movie. And I bring that up because again, this is they show us this stuff
57:37.240 --> 57:41.880
in movies all the time of how this stuff really works. I'll give you a crazy example. You won't
57:41.880 --> 57:48.920
believe me. There's a stupid comedy from 1999 2001 somewhere in there. Josie and the Pussycats.
57:48.920 --> 57:54.360
Kind of goofy, silly. But that whole movie is about the military industrial complex studying
57:54.360 --> 57:59.080
pop culture to alter culture. That's the plot of the movie. If you don't believe me, go watch it.
57:59.080 --> 58:05.240
Interesting. I did not know that. And of course, Bernays nephew of Freud, you know, that's why you
58:05.240 --> 58:10.840
have the aspect of why sexuality has been such an important and powerful way for them to use and to
58:10.840 --> 58:15.160
ultimately control people. And that's why much many of these cults kind of evolve around the
58:15.160 --> 58:20.200
that there is another kind of, you know, tie in that they can hook people on and stuff like that.
58:20.200 --> 58:24.440
And then of course, the other subculture in Hollywood is of course, the poor pornography
58:24.440 --> 58:28.280
industry, right, which is like, you know, it all ties into each other, basically here.
58:28.280 --> 58:32.440
Did you see the the people the actress from Smallville, Allison Mack?
58:32.440 --> 58:37.400
No, no. Well, it was just busted that she was running a sex cult.
58:38.200 --> 58:42.760
Oh, interesting. I did not know that. So the girl from Smallville, Allison Mack,
58:42.760 --> 58:49.400
was running a sex cult and what they were doing was she was had a handler.
58:49.400 --> 58:55.400
She was out recruiting women to come be in the sex cult. And I think she recruited like 29 women.
58:57.000 --> 58:58.520
Mainstream news last week.
58:58.520 --> 59:01.480
Interesting. Very interesting. Tell us about the Black Dahlia stuff then.
59:02.120 --> 59:04.280
Touch on that here a little bit towards the end, Jay.
59:04.280 --> 59:08.840
Yeah, this is I don't claim to be an expert. I just kind of know the basic ideas of the story.
59:09.640 --> 59:14.440
And then there's kind of a couple of famous books, Black Dahlia Avenger by Steve Hodel.
59:14.440 --> 59:19.160
And Steve Hodel argues that it seems to be that his dad was probably the best
59:20.760 --> 59:25.560
case suspect for who was behind this. Other books, too, have point. I came across this
59:25.560 --> 59:29.400
book Exquisite Corpse. And the reason I bring this book in is because
59:30.200 --> 59:39.080
Exquisite Corpse ties it into the surrealist movement and the prevailing thesis as to who
59:39.080 --> 59:46.200
was involved in the murder of Elizabeth Short in 1947. And the murder has very clear cult
59:46.200 --> 59:51.800
overtones because the body is dismembered and it's cut with surgical precision and et cetera,
59:51.800 --> 59:58.040
et cetera. The idea and it was made into a Brian De Palma movie, which actually kind of is similar
59:58.040 --> 01:00:05.080
to Eyes Wide Shut, by the way. But what you see in the Black Dahlia case is somebody who
01:00:05.880 --> 01:00:11.960
appears to have had a predilection for surrealist art, and particularly the art of Man Ray.
01:00:12.840 --> 01:00:19.640
When you look at Man Ray's The Minotaur, you see a body in his artwork that is cut up in the exact
01:00:20.280 --> 01:00:26.760
or very similar form to the body of Elizabeth Short. And, you know, Man Ray, I think, if I recall,
01:00:27.720 --> 01:00:32.920
did describe himself as a Luciferian. And so Man Ray's hanging out with Salvador Dali and he's
01:00:32.920 --> 01:00:38.840
hanging out with George Hodel. And George Hodel is who most people consider, you know, one of the
01:00:38.840 --> 01:00:46.200
key suspects because Hodel was a backdoor back alley abortionist. So he was a surgeon, so he had
01:00:47.720 --> 01:00:53.560
surgical precision. And he was also convicted pedophile. And he hung out with people in the
01:00:53.560 --> 01:00:57.400
Laurel Canyon scene. He hung out with John Phillips of the Mamas and Papas. And he hung out
01:00:57.400 --> 01:01:05.400
with John Huston, who last time we talked about stars in Roman Polanski's Chinatown as the
01:01:05.400 --> 01:01:10.520
pedophile. Right. Interesting. So here's John Huston hanging out with George Hodel, convicted
01:01:10.520 --> 01:01:13.480
pedophile. He would have orgies and they would sleep. He slept with his daughter, by the way.
01:01:14.280 --> 01:01:21.640
I think her name was Tamar Hodel. And he's hanging out with Man Ray. And so I think most
01:01:21.640 --> 01:01:26.920
people think that probably that's who was behind this famous ritual murder. But the reason it's
01:01:27.880 --> 01:01:34.040
so hyped up and talked about is because it's one of the clear, you know, early cases of ritual
01:01:34.040 --> 01:01:39.800
murder, which has these surrealist artwork undertones and overtones. And if you look at the
01:01:39.800 --> 01:01:43.000
art of Man Ray, I don't mean the stuff that you find on Google. I mean, like the stuff that's
01:01:43.000 --> 01:01:53.560
in this book. I mean, it's it's nasty stuff. I mean, it's out of his gourd. And but what I'm
01:01:53.560 --> 01:01:58.840
getting at is just that, you know, there's obviously some kind of a cult cult nexus with this with this
01:01:58.840 --> 01:02:04.520
murder. And it's all these these high level Hollywood people that seem to be in the circles.
01:02:05.240 --> 01:02:10.120
Yeah, very interesting. Yeah. I saw too you had these Rose McGowan was in there.
01:02:10.200 --> 01:02:15.880
And the she's in that movie. Exactly. Yeah. She comes out of one of the Hollywood cults.
01:02:15.880 --> 01:02:20.360
Yep, she does. And now she's in another cult that's going to turn things in a different direction.
01:02:20.360 --> 01:02:25.640
The Terminus cult. Exactly. That's just it. All right. Well, interesting. What else? Anything else
01:02:25.640 --> 01:02:30.520
we should mention about Manson or I mean, so he's dead now. Is it going to get even worse now with
01:02:30.520 --> 01:02:34.040
his kind of cult status or something like that? I mean, I doubt it, to be honest. I mean, he's
01:02:34.040 --> 01:02:39.400
just kind of a wacko, right? To most people. I mean, I know that he was the tons of women lined
01:02:39.400 --> 01:02:43.080
up and they wanted to have sex with him and they just love him. And you know, for some reason,
01:02:43.080 --> 01:02:47.880
that happens. And women are some women are like that. They're drawn to that stuff. But but beyond
01:02:47.880 --> 01:02:53.240
that, which is a kind of an outlier and anomaly, frankly, are they going to be able to continue
01:02:53.240 --> 01:02:59.560
to use him? Or is the Charles Manson Manson chapter finally closed at this point? I'm thinking now
01:02:59.560 --> 01:03:04.680
that there's an opening for the role, I'm going to audition and I'm not going to be as nutty.
01:03:04.680 --> 01:03:08.600
But I think what I'm going to do is have just specifically a cult for supermodels only.
01:03:09.480 --> 01:03:13.080
So we're not going to have any of these street skanks like he tried to recruit. I
01:03:13.800 --> 01:03:18.840
know I won't be up to quality. I won't have any any markings on my forehead. But no, I'm joking.
01:03:20.600 --> 01:03:24.920
I don't know what will come of it. I think he seems to have kind of fizzled out. I mean,
01:03:24.920 --> 01:03:28.360
I know what you're talking about with the stories of people sleeping with him and whatnot. But
01:03:30.600 --> 01:03:33.560
I mean, I saw an interview a couple years ago where they were
01:03:33.560 --> 01:03:36.280
rolling Manson out talking about climate change.
01:03:39.080 --> 01:03:41.320
That has to be to discredit climate change then, right?
01:03:42.600 --> 01:03:47.960
Or he really maybe he really believes that, you know, because it's all apocalyptic. I mean,
01:03:47.960 --> 01:03:53.560
it's not thought out. It's just anything that's apocalyptic. Exactly. And that it's all helter
01:03:53.560 --> 01:03:57.240
skelter, right? I mean, that's what it goes back to. Ultimately, the shit's going to go down,
01:03:57.240 --> 01:04:02.360
it's going to all fall apart. And and but somehow these people are there to kind of make sure that
01:04:02.360 --> 01:04:07.160
it also happens. It's always the fulfillment of the prophecy itself, right? That the race
01:04:07.160 --> 01:04:13.320
war stuff that supposedly was encoded into the Beatles album and the song helter skelter was,
01:04:13.320 --> 01:04:18.680
you know, that they wrote that on the on the on the on the fridge, I think they were pig on
01:04:18.680 --> 01:04:25.000
on Tate's door. And they wanted it to see seemed that it was the the Black Panthers movement at
01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:29.960
the time that had done these murders, right? To kind of instigate a Yeah, they seem to think
01:04:29.960 --> 01:04:36.200
that it would kick off the race war. I guess that didn't exactly happen the way they thought it
01:04:36.200 --> 01:04:43.320
would. But but then don't forget, didn't squeaky try to assassinate somebody squeaky from?
01:04:44.040 --> 01:04:49.640
I have no idea. I think she tried to kill somebody. So I may be misremembering. But point
01:04:49.640 --> 01:04:56.200
being, I think the big takeaway from Manson, and all these California Colts is these are social
01:04:56.200 --> 01:05:00.840
experiments. And, you know, to whatever degree they are, aren't controlled individuals, I think
01:05:00.840 --> 01:05:05.960
that what we can see is that their impact is really part of large scale social engineering
01:05:05.960 --> 01:05:11.960
promotion of degeneracy, basically. And, you know, promote the whole 60s stuff promoted,
01:05:11.960 --> 01:05:17.880
the rock and roll promoted, free sex, free love, all this stuff, which just revolutionized.
01:05:17.880 --> 01:05:24.840
In other words, without Manson in the 60s, we wouldn't be at, you know, tranny Sylvania where
01:05:24.840 --> 01:05:36.520
we are now. Exactly. Count Dracula. We wouldn't be there without Manson in the 60s revolution.
01:05:36.520 --> 01:05:40.840
Exactly. It's true. And people need to remember that that like these people instigated these
01:05:40.840 --> 01:05:45.640
murderous Colts are those who just continue the social engineering and now we're at the
01:05:45.640 --> 01:05:49.960
stage that we're at that all this stuff is just like no one is these people are pushing this. I
01:05:49.960 --> 01:05:55.800
mean, I don't they're not serious about this. It's not about equality and fairness and loving
01:05:55.800 --> 01:06:00.200
yourself and all that kind of bullshit. I mean, they just they're using whatever method they can
01:06:00.200 --> 01:06:05.960
to push through and transform culture. And they're using these, you know, victimized groups or
01:06:05.960 --> 01:06:10.680
whatever, and to let people, you know, drop the guard and basically allow the transformation of
01:06:10.680 --> 01:06:17.240
society to occur. But ultimately, that transformation is to control. And it's to dominate
01:06:17.320 --> 01:06:21.160
society and basically end up in a position where they can they know what's going to happen. We
01:06:21.160 --> 01:06:25.000
predict the future because we invented and we control the world and everything is in order
01:06:25.000 --> 01:06:28.520
in place. It might seem like a big stretch and kind of weird to people. But the reality is that
01:06:28.520 --> 01:06:34.360
this is their they're trying any method that they can right now. The victimization groups and all
01:06:34.360 --> 01:06:38.760
that stuff is very beneficial to transforming society. It's working. That's why they're pushing
01:06:38.760 --> 01:06:44.280
it. Yeah, fake, fake victim, victimhood, fake guilt, all this kind of nonsense, which is all weaponized.
01:06:45.160 --> 01:06:50.360
But yes, that's that's key. I mean, in other words, even even the the mash put mass push for gay
01:06:50.360 --> 01:06:56.520
rights, you couldn't have that without previous made up, you know, oppression and rights that had
01:06:56.520 --> 01:07:02.440
to be it's all it's all made up. It's all, you know, the most minuscule little group of, you
01:07:02.440 --> 01:07:07.240
know, oh, I actually believe that I'm a ferret. I'm a ferret. I'm oppressed because you don't
01:07:07.240 --> 01:07:13.400
accept that I'm a ferret. And therefore, I need government funding. And I need the Georgia
01:07:13.400 --> 01:07:19.560
I need George Soros to create the the the Ferret Foundation. Right. Yeah. And the
01:07:19.560 --> 01:07:25.400
fur transplant. Call me a you will call me a fucking ferret. Yeah. You go to jail and you
01:07:25.400 --> 01:07:32.360
lose and you need to pay for my fur transplant. All the rest of it. I'm having my body elongated
01:07:32.360 --> 01:07:37.320
so that I can be a ferret. Anything's possible, man. I would just well just you wait until we
01:07:37.320 --> 01:07:41.560
upload ourselves to computers and run simulations, then you can do all of that stuff. Don't worry
01:07:41.560 --> 01:07:46.280
about it. You know, well, it will just be a big avatar as the movie implies, you know.
01:07:47.480 --> 01:07:52.600
All right, Jay. Well, awesome. Thank you for for talking about Madison with us. Of course,
01:07:52.600 --> 01:07:57.000
ladies and gentlemen, if you want to find out more about Jay's work, jay's analysis.com.
01:07:57.000 --> 01:08:01.960
That's the website I see has a post on QAnon, which is interesting. We won't have time to talk
01:08:01.960 --> 01:08:04.600
about that today. But that would actually be interesting having you back and getting your
01:08:04.600 --> 01:08:08.920
take on that, actually, because it's been all the rave lately for some interesting reason. But
01:08:09.640 --> 01:08:16.600
I don't that the post was a little misleading on purpose. I don't actually think that there was a
01:08:16.600 --> 01:08:21.240
guy leaking things on fortune. Well, people on fortune were messaging me. I was getting all
01:08:21.240 --> 01:08:24.440
these tweets. I got like 100 tweets the other day. They were like, Why are you Q? Are you? I don't
01:08:24.440 --> 01:08:29.000
know what you're talking about. Q from Star Trek. I used to watch Star Trek. There was a character
01:08:29.000 --> 01:08:33.880
named Q. What are you talking about? So so I looked into it for several days. And then I tried to
01:08:33.880 --> 01:08:39.400
dig into, you know, are the Clintons being thrown under the bus? That's very possible with
01:08:39.400 --> 01:08:43.960
Donna Brazile. You talked about that. And then it looks like the podestas are being investigated.
01:08:43.960 --> 01:08:50.840
They're lobbying firms shutting down. But does that mean that all this weird code language of Q
01:08:50.840 --> 01:08:56.120
like we're gonna have secret decoder rings or some bullshit now? Come on. I mean, it's anonymous.
01:08:56.120 --> 01:09:01.480
Why is somebody speaking in code on anonymous chat for him? It's a bunch of questions. That's all
01:09:01.480 --> 01:09:05.560
it is. Right? It's a bunch of questions. It's like some of them, which are good questions. Sure.
01:09:05.560 --> 01:09:10.520
Of course. Yeah. It doesn't mean anything. But what I did was just try to try to take a realistic
01:09:10.520 --> 01:09:16.200
approach to what may be actually going on in that video, which did pretty good. 30,000 in a
01:09:16.200 --> 01:09:21.160
couple of days. Interesting. Yeah. As I said, it's been the latest rage lately. We gotta get into it.
01:09:21.160 --> 01:09:25.480
All right. Well, thank you, Jay. Really appreciate it. The book, of course, Esoteric Hollywood is
01:09:25.560 --> 01:09:31.720
available through the site as well. You have your TV show. What else should we know about?
01:09:32.520 --> 01:09:38.600
Anything else going on? I'm doing presently still a globalist books series where I've been
01:09:38.600 --> 01:09:43.160
going through the different books of globalist. Last I did Arthur Kessler's Ghost in the Machine,
01:09:43.800 --> 01:09:49.160
where Kessler lays out a lot of stuff that actually ties into what we've been talking about with
01:09:49.720 --> 01:09:55.560
the chemical biological engineering of people through food, GMOs, water, that kind of stuff.
01:09:56.280 --> 01:10:02.280
Kessler, again, part of the Royal Society, Hungarian Jewish expatriate Marxist who's
01:10:02.840 --> 01:10:09.560
awarded all these awards and said how great he is by the British Royal Society. Why do they always
01:10:09.560 --> 01:10:17.000
love Marxists at the Royal Society? It's because they're promoting Marxists. And then I did H.G.
01:10:17.000 --> 01:10:22.520
Wells and I did Brzezinski's books and I did, you know, Tragedy and Hope last year. So next up,
01:10:22.520 --> 01:10:29.880
what I'll be delving into is one of Jonah Salk's books. So here we have another one of these
01:10:29.880 --> 01:10:35.160
psychopathic heroes, the father of vaccines. Why does Jonah Salk write a book about killing
01:10:35.160 --> 01:10:42.280
everybody and using RNA viruses? Interesting. But he's the hero father of vaccines.
01:10:42.280 --> 01:10:46.760
Yeah, supposedly. Although he was just partially part of that process, but he was given the
01:10:46.760 --> 01:10:49.640
full credit for some reason. There was actually a team around him at the time. But, you know,
01:10:49.640 --> 01:10:55.400
again, they pushed these heroes out there for us, right? For some interesting reason. All right,
01:10:55.400 --> 01:10:58.600
that's interesting. And then Hollywood Decoded, obviously, as we said, I'm clicking in on that
01:10:58.600 --> 01:11:05.800
link as we speak. And that's over at Gaia as well. Is that so that's like a season one, 15 episodes,
01:11:05.800 --> 01:11:11.240
it's all there, I guess. Is there more of that coming? There's 23 episodes. So they come out
01:11:11.240 --> 01:11:17.880
every week. And I think the last episode where we did Christopher Nolan films, we did Inception and
01:11:20.920 --> 01:11:25.800
Interstellar and but I don't know what the most recent releases are.
01:11:25.800 --> 01:11:30.200
Okay, cool. Well, thank you for joining us today. Really appreciate it. Always a pleasure having
01:11:30.200 --> 01:11:34.280
you on. Thank you, man. Keep up the good work and we'll talk soon again. Okay, I hope you enjoy the
01:11:34.280 --> 01:11:38.440
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We'll be back soon to all our American listeners. Have a great Thanksgiving and don't give in when
01:13:13.320 --> 01:13:17.640
it comes to letting your friends and relatives tell you about how evil the pioneers, the pilgrims,
01:13:17.640 --> 01:13:21.400
the settlers were. There is a great deal of information out there that actually tells the
01:13:21.400 --> 01:13:26.760
truth about what really happened and how things were at that time. So read up on it. You know,
01:13:26.760 --> 01:13:30.280
today we're expected to take in and help all these other people, but back then, you know,
01:13:30.760 --> 01:13:35.480
no one wanted to help the Europeans, right? We were not allowed to go to safe lands to those
01:13:35.480 --> 01:13:39.320
who were religiously persecuted and everything else. Very interesting. Anyway, have a good one.
01:13:39.320 --> 01:13:50.840
We'll see you on the next one. Take care.