1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:12,000
Music

2
00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:18,000
Major funding for American Experiences provided by the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation.

3
00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:23,000
National corporate funding is provided by Liberty Mutual and the Scotts Company.

4
00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:27,000
Additional funding provided by the Ford Foundation.

5
00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:33,000
American Experiences also made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting.

6
00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:37,000
And by contributions to your PBS station from viewers like you.

7
00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:39,000
Thank you.

8
00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:07,000
Nobody joins the cult. Nobody joins something that thinks it's going to hurt them.

9
00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:15,000
Join our religious organization, you join a political movement and you join with people that you really like.

10
00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:22,000
I think in everything that I tell you about Jim Jones, this is going to be a paradox.

11
00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:32,000
Having this vision to change the world but having this whole undercurrent of this function that was underneath that vision.

12
00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:40,000
Some people see great deal of God in my body. They see Christ in me, a whole pegrower.

13
00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:44,000
He said, if you see me as your friend, I'll be your friend.

14
00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:51,000
As you see me as your father, I'll be your father. He said, if you see me as your God, I'll be your God.

15
00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:56,000
Jim Jones talked about going to the Promised Land.

16
00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:01,000
And then, pretty soon, we were seeing film footage of Jones down.

17
00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,000
Rice, black eyed peas, collade.

18
00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:07,000
We all wanted to go. I wanted to go.

19
00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:17,000
People's temple truly had the potential to be something big and powerful and great.

20
00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:25,000
And yet, for whatever reason, Jim took the other road.

21
00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:30,000
On the night of the 17th, it was still a vibrant community.

22
00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:36,000
I would never have imagined that 24 hours later they would all be there.

23
00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:41,000
I would not have imagined that the world would be there.

24
00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:46,000
I would never have imagined that the world would be there.

25
00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:01,000
I vividly remember the first time that I met Jim Jones.

26
00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:08,000
My sister, Carolyn, had invited my parents and my younger sister and I to visit her in Potter Valley.

27
00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:14,000
We came and there was a strange man in her house and her husband wasn't there.

28
00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:17,000
And he and I were sent out to go on a walk.

29
00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:22,000
When we came back, something had happened.

30
00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:28,000
Something terrible had happened because everyone had read eyes except for Jim Jones.

31
00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:34,000
We didn't really get the story until we were in the car going home.

32
00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:39,000
He was carrying on an adulterous relationship with my sister.

33
00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:46,000
And because his wife couldn't relate to him as a wife that Carolyn had taken over that role.

34
00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:52,000
Everything was plausible, except in retrospect, the whole thing seems absolutely bizarre.

35
00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:05,000
We're first time I visited people's temple.

36
00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:14,000
I drove at the urging on the front of them, the coworker to remedy valley.

37
00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:20,000
We all got suited down next time.

38
00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:24,000
They're banging, you know, and we were shocked.

39
00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:31,000
As soon as I walked in to the San Francisco temple, I was home.

40
00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:41,000
I was one of those kind of guys that I used drugs.

41
00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:49,000
I was at politics. I was like, I'm all these people that were like my age.

42
00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,000
They were clean.

43
00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:56,000
Before I came here, I was taking LSD marijuana.

44
00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:58,000
Every type of dope you can imagine.

45
00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:01,000
Without our passage in Jones, it teach me the right way.

46
00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,000
I would not be in college right now.

47
00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:07,000
And for me, that was like, wow, very, very much.

48
00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:10,000
Thank you very much. Thank you.

49
00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:14,000
There was an intellectual group. The choir was an erasure.

50
00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:16,000
And they used to sing this song.

51
00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:19,000
Never heard a man speak like this man before.

52
00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:23,000
All the days of my life ever since I've been born.

53
00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:27,000
I never heard a man speak like this man before.

54
00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:31,000
After they sang one or two songs, the whole place was lit up.

55
00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:34,000
I wrote a song that I sang, and I wrote a song that I sang before.

56
00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:36,000
I wrote a song that I sang before.

57
00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:39,000
I wrote a song that I sang before.

58
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:42,000
I wrote a song that I sang before.

59
00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:44,000
I wrote a song that I sang before.

60
00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:46,000
I wrote a song that I sang before.

61
00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:50,000
The people's temple services.

62
00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:55,000
They had life. They had soul. They had power.

63
00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,000
We were alive in those services.

64
00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:08,000
I would be up jumping in the balcony and popping my hands.

65
00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:12,000
If you came in as a stranger and didn't know anything about the politics,

66
00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:17,000
you were thinking you were entering an old time religion service.

67
00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:26,000
By the time Jones did come out to do his speaking,

68
00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,000
the table had already been set.

69
00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:32,000
I represent divine principle. Totally quality.

70
00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:35,000
A society where people own all things in common.

71
00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:38,000
There is no rich or poorer, but there are no races.

72
00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:41,000
Wherever there's people's struggle for justice and righteousness,

73
00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:44,000
and there's no justice.

74
00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:48,000
But he spoke about things that were in our hearts.

75
00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,000
The government was not taken care of the people.

76
00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,000
There were too many poor people out there. There were poor children.

77
00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:56,000
The world is like a human family.

78
00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:59,000
The little child may not be able to go and draw a paycheck,

79
00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:01,000
but the father guarantees the child care.

80
00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:03,000
The grandmother may not be able to work anymore,

81
00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:07,000
but the father and mother guarantees her the right to live.

82
00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:11,000
Every single person felt that they had a purpose there

83
00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:14,000
and that they were exceptionally special.

84
00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:18,000
And that is how he brought so many young college kids in,

85
00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:24,000
so many older, black women in, so many people from diverse backgrounds

86
00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:28,000
who realized that there was something bigger than themselves

87
00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:32,000
that they needed to be involved in, and that Jim Jones offered them.

88
00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:39,000
I went home, told Mom, you know what?

89
00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:41,000
This is the right church for me.

90
00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:46,000
It was the next week that I became a member of People's Temple.

91
00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:48,000
I went to a people's Temple.

92
00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:51,000
I went to a people's Temple.

93
00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,000
I went home to a people's Temple.

94
00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,000
I went home to a people's Temple.

95
00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:56,000
I went home to a people's Temple.

96
00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,000
I went home to a people's Temple.

97
00:07:58,000 --> 00:07:59,000
I went home to a people's Temple.

98
00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:00,000
I went home to a people's Temple.

99
00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:04,000
There's a little town in Indiana.

100
00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:07,000
The moment I think of it, a great deal of pain comes.

101
00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:16,000
As a child, I was undoubtedly one of the poor in the community.

102
00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:18,000
Never accepted.

103
00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:21,000
Born as we're on the wrong side of the tracks.

104
00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:27,000
I grew up with too many Jones.

105
00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,000
We started first grade together.

106
00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:35,000
My brothers used to go over to Jimmy's house

107
00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:41,000
and hung around his barn, which was where he played.

108
00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:45,000
From the time I was five years old,

109
00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:48,000
I thought Jimmy was a really weird kid.

110
00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:51,000
There was something not quite right.

111
00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,000
He was obsessed with religion.

112
00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,000
He was obsessed with death.

113
00:08:57,000 --> 00:09:01,000
My brothers came back with stories of him conducting funerals

114
00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:04,000
for small animals that had died.

115
00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:08,000
A friend of mine told me that he saw a Jimmy Kellock cat with a knife.

116
00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:12,000
While having a funeral for it was a little strange,

117
00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:15,000
killing the animals was very strange.

118
00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:20,000
Jimmy's father did not work, did not have a job,

119
00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:23,000
and was a drunk.

120
00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:28,000
Jim's mother had to work in order to support the family.

121
00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,000
And he was kind of left to his own devices.

122
00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:34,000
You know, kind of the kid who ran away all of the street, you know what I mean?

123
00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:37,000
Listen, he was a dysfunctional family.

124
00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:41,000
We got a nice name for it now.

125
00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:45,000
But when you live in a dysfunctional family, you think it's normal.

126
00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:59,000
Feeling as an outcast, I'd early developed a sensitivity for the problems of black.

127
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:04,000
I brought the only black young man in the town home.

128
00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,000
And my dad said that he could not come in.

129
00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:11,000
And I said that I shant and I did not see my dad for many years.

130
00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:18,000
I'm a son of a job.

131
00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:25,000
In the land, Jim Jones looked for community and couldn't find community in Linn as a town,

132
00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:28,000
which had a population of 1,000 people.

133
00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:33,000
But he did find community in the Pentecostal church.

134
00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:40,000
He saw that they were a surrogate home.

135
00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:46,000
He saw that the preachers were like father figures to their congregations.

136
00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:52,000
And that role represented power over the lives of your congregation.

137
00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:01,000
Jim Jones started out on the revival preaching circuit,

138
00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:04,000
learning the ropes of being a preacher.

139
00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:09,000
And once he started doing that, it became clear that he could get a following.

140
00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:15,000
The first time I met Jim Jones was Easter 1953.

141
00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:21,000
My mother-in-law, Edith Cardell, had a monkey and it hung itself.

142
00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:23,000
And she wanted to replace the monkey.

143
00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:25,000
So she looked in the end of an apple star.

144
00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:33,000
And in that end, an apple star was Jim Jones's ad that he had some monkeys to sell.

145
00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:43,000
So it was through that that she met Jim Jones and came back saying that he'd invited her to church this next Sunday.

146
00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:53,000
She didn't make no difference what color you were.

147
00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:56,000
They was there by welcome there in that church.

148
00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:58,000
And he made it very plain from the platform.

149
00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:03,000
He had some people to disagree with Jimmy that got up on the audience and said they disagreed with it.

150
00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:08,000
They did not like this integration part of his services.

151
00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:12,000
We did ask people to leave the church one night because of that.

152
00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:20,000
I was the first Negro child adopted by a Caucasian family's divine, yeah.

153
00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:25,000
Jim and Marcelin actually went to adopt the Caucasian child.

154
00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:32,000
The story goes that was crying, real loud, and a draw, a due attention from Marcelin to come over.

155
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:38,000
And once she picked me up, I stopped crying.

156
00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:41,000
My family was a template of a rainbow family.

157
00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:44,000
We had an African American.

158
00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:48,000
We had two American Asian.

159
00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:52,000
And we had as natural son homemade.

160
00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:58,000
Jim was breaking new ground in race relations.

161
00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:04,000
At a time when the ground was still pretty hard against that.

162
00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:13,000
Jim Jones was hated and despised by some people, particularly in the white community.

163
00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:21,000
There had been pressures on him to leave Indianapolis.

164
00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:30,000
He thought that Indianapolis was two races of a place for him to be, and he wanted to take his people out.

165
00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:36,000
California is perceived to be a very progressive state.

166
00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:42,000
This would be the place to implement the dream of racial equality.

167
00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:49,000
Not Indianapolis, which seems hopeless, but California, which seems to be the promised land.

168
00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:54,000
He chose Eucaya in northern California about 90 miles north of San Francisco.

169
00:13:54,000 --> 00:14:06,000
Because there was an article in Esquire Magazine that said that Eucaya was one of the nine places in the world that in the event, a thermonuclear attack, people would survive.

170
00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:14,000
I told Eideth, if you followed Jimi to California, you're crazy.

171
00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:25,000
So what did Jimi do but took it to a psychiatrist and sent me a certified letter that she is of sound mind, and she is not crazy?

172
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:29,000
I was there the afternoon that Eideth drove away.

173
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:34,000
I didn't know I'd never see her again.

174
00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:43,000
I was there the day when I was in the middle of the day.

175
00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:47,000
I was there the day when I was in the middle of the day.

176
00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:50,000
The movie California was really fun.

177
00:14:50,000 --> 00:15:05,000
There were about 12, 15 cars driving the cross, and I said, making that journey to a place, not a snooze.

178
00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:07,000
I didn't imagine.

179
00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:12,000
We were going to California, our new world.

180
00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:20,000
When I saw Redwood Valley, I couldn't believe my eyes because it was like a paradise.

181
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:23,000
It was rural, it was green.

182
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:28,000
There were great fines everywhere, and I fell in love.

183
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:32,000
I said, this is going to be a perfect way to live.

184
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:40,000
I started with about 141 people from that we've grown to a very thriving congregation.

185
00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:45,000
We have about every level of society, all this economic income is traded.

186
00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:50,000
We're in a professional and down to your ordinary field worker field labor.

187
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:53,000
It's beautiful to see that all these divisions have been broken down.

188
00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:57,000
I want to raise to any differences of economic position.

189
00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:11,000
The focus of Jim's message was taken from the Bible where Jesus in his earliest days told people to sell all things and have all things in common.

190
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:18,000
Jesus Christ had the most, what was there teachings to be said in the sense that he said to feed the hungry clothes and naked.

191
00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:23,000
Take in the stranger, minister to those who whittes and afflicted in their suffering.

192
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:28,000
And we feel that no one really tried Christianity to affect him there, the Judeo Christian tradition.

193
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:35,000
The membership increased substantially as he procured more and more Graham buses.

194
00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:38,000
And fixed them up.

195
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:43,000
And every summer he began this cross country tour.

196
00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:54,000
The purpose of the bus trips was to spread Jim's beliefs about socialism and the world and how we can live a better life and about an integrated lifestyle.

197
00:16:54,000 --> 00:17:00,000
But behind that, I think it was together more members for the temple.

198
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:06,000
That's beautiful to hear.

199
00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:09,000
We are so time to meet.

200
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:16,000
I decided not to go to Vietnam and I was just the point of what am I going to do with myself.

201
00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:23,000
I heard Jim Jones is going to be coming to Philadelphia and coming to Benjamin Franklin High School.

202
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:31,000
And I went Wednesday night and I listened to him and I was impressed by how is such an interracial group and people were really happy.

203
00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,000
I got nothing to lose.

204
00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:36,000
I was going to stand looking at the faces and say, coming, I'll give you a job.

205
00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,000
Coming, I'll give you a home.

206
00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:40,000
Coming, I'll give you a bed.

207
00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:42,000
I got nothing to pinch it.

208
00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:44,000
Don't leave your pinched behind.

209
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:45,000
I'll tell you that.

210
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,000
Who tell you I'll put you on that bus tomorrow?

211
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:57,000
I heard Jim Jones talking about equality, man, races, what it's like in living in California and in the Redwood Valley.

212
00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:00,000
The good works that they're doing.

213
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:04,000
Things that I wanted to get involved with but didn't even know where to make an entree.

214
00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,000
And all of a sudden the answer was there.

215
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:11,000
Somebody is going to get on the freedom train.

216
00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:12,000
It's going to help you.

217
00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:20,000
He was there for three evenings and the third evening I went off in the bus and came to California.

218
00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:37,000
When I joined People's Temple in the spring of 1966 there were exactly 81 members.

219
00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:47,000
Five years later an extended family of 80 people had become an organization of thousands.

220
00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:56,000
People's Temple really was a black church.

221
00:18:56,000 --> 00:19:03,000
It was led by a white minister but in terms of the worship service commitment to the social gospel,

222
00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:05,000
it's membership.

223
00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:08,000
It functions completely like a black church.

224
00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:09,000
He talked black.

225
00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:10,000
He really understood it.

226
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:14,000
He understood how it was to be treated differently.

227
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,000
And that's from his roots coming out.

228
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:21,000
When people heard Jim they didn't look upon him as being a white preacher.

229
00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:24,000
People didn't look at Jim as being white.

230
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:25,000
He was not white.

231
00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:27,000
He was just here for a few years.

232
00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,000
You're going to go to Texas with me when I have a chair.

233
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:31,000
Yes, one day with that.

234
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:32,000
Good goal.

235
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,000
I'm not going to go.

236
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,000
I of course you go.

237
00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:37,000
You went to Mexico with me.

238
00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:43,980
As older people joined it took a year or so and he convinced the people that you know he

239
00:19:43,980 --> 00:19:45,980
was doing so much in the community.

240
00:19:45,980 --> 00:19:49,980
And so why not rather than just tie your 20 percent?

241
00:19:49,980 --> 00:19:51,980
Why not sell your home?

242
00:19:51,980 --> 00:19:53,980
Give them any to the church.

243
00:19:53,980 --> 00:19:56,980
And that is what people began to do.

244
00:19:56,980 --> 00:20:00,980
Now in this church, what have we done in this short time?

245
00:20:00,980 --> 00:20:06,980
We have four seniors sit-as-in homes that are the most innovating, the most beautiful you want to see.

246
00:20:06,980 --> 00:20:08,980
They had their own rooms.

247
00:20:08,980 --> 00:20:10,980
They had every need taken care of.

248
00:20:10,980 --> 00:20:12,980
They had their food provided.

249
00:20:12,980 --> 00:20:15,980
They were well looked after.

250
00:20:15,980 --> 00:20:19,980
Now my home is stone block and there's not a piece of new furniture in it.

251
00:20:19,980 --> 00:20:22,980
But our seniors sit-as-in homes, they're elegant.

252
00:20:22,980 --> 00:20:23,980
And that's beautiful.

253
00:20:23,980 --> 00:20:27,980
They were giving their life's money and savings to the church.

254
00:20:27,980 --> 00:20:34,980
But in exchange, the church was agreeing to take care of them in the community not just in a nursing home.

255
00:20:34,980 --> 00:20:51,980
Well, it got to the point where there were so many duties in the temple that some people had to become full time.

256
00:20:51,980 --> 00:20:55,980
So when you were full time temple, you worked about 20 hours a day.

257
00:20:55,980 --> 00:20:57,980
My kind of ran like this.

258
00:20:57,980 --> 00:21:00,980
I worked my regular job on Mondays, you know, eight to five.

259
00:21:00,980 --> 00:21:01,980
Then I worked on files.

260
00:21:01,980 --> 00:21:04,980
There were people who ran rest homes.

261
00:21:04,980 --> 00:21:06,980
There were animals to be taken care of.

262
00:21:06,980 --> 00:21:07,980
There were the publications.

263
00:21:07,980 --> 00:21:08,980
Everybody had a job.

264
00:21:08,980 --> 00:21:09,980
We sat at night.

265
00:21:09,980 --> 00:21:14,980
We'd have a meeting in Redwood Valley and I'd go to the meeting for till probably 10 or 10 30 days.

266
00:21:14,980 --> 00:21:15,980
We turned our page extra over.

267
00:21:15,980 --> 00:21:16,980
Every time we got paid.

268
00:21:16,980 --> 00:21:18,980
And then we got an allowance.

269
00:21:18,980 --> 00:21:19,980
$5 a week.

270
00:21:19,980 --> 00:21:24,980
And Friday I'd go to work and I'd get off of work and I'd hop on the bus or drive the bus to San Francisco.

271
00:21:24,980 --> 00:21:27,980
If I had to go to the doctor or stay here, I'd go to the dentist or stay in care of.

272
00:21:27,980 --> 00:21:29,980
If I needed clothes that was taken care of.

273
00:21:29,980 --> 00:21:33,980
And often on Saturday night we had planning commission meetings till 2 or 3 in the morning.

274
00:21:33,980 --> 00:21:35,980
We would always try to let each other know next day.

275
00:21:35,980 --> 00:21:36,980
Well, how long did you sleep?

276
00:21:36,980 --> 00:21:37,980
I was up to hours.

277
00:21:37,980 --> 00:21:38,980
You only slept too.

278
00:21:38,980 --> 00:21:40,980
Well, I slept an hour and a half.

279
00:21:40,980 --> 00:21:42,980
And then Sunday we'd have a Sunday morning service.

280
00:21:42,980 --> 00:21:43,980
And then around 1 o'clock.

281
00:21:43,980 --> 00:21:44,980
Hop on the buses.

282
00:21:44,980 --> 00:21:45,980
Drive up.

283
00:21:45,980 --> 00:21:48,980
Drop people off in San Francisco and drive up to Redwood Valley.

284
00:21:48,980 --> 00:21:51,980
The longest I ever stayed awake was six days.

285
00:21:51,980 --> 00:21:53,980
And that's with no coffee.

286
00:21:53,980 --> 00:21:54,980
No nothing.

287
00:21:54,980 --> 00:21:55,980
It changed over the years.

288
00:21:55,980 --> 00:21:57,980
But it was always busy.

289
00:21:58,980 --> 00:22:03,980
Being an environment where you're constantly up, you're constantly busy.

290
00:22:03,980 --> 00:22:05,980
And you're made to feel guilty.

291
00:22:05,980 --> 00:22:08,980
If you take too many luxuries like sleeping,

292
00:22:08,980 --> 00:22:11,980
you tend to not really think for yourself.

293
00:22:11,980 --> 00:22:17,980
And I did allow Jones to think for me because I figured that he had the better plan.

294
00:22:17,980 --> 00:22:22,980
I gave my rights up to him as many others did.

295
00:22:23,980 --> 00:22:25,980
E.D.

296
00:22:25,980 --> 00:22:30,980
Pingers are your fingers numb.

297
00:22:30,980 --> 00:22:33,980
And you lie.

298
00:22:33,980 --> 00:22:37,980
Reach the fingers out to her bothering you.

299
00:22:37,980 --> 00:22:43,980
Now, has it been gone?

300
00:22:43,980 --> 00:22:48,980
There was no same to say.

301
00:22:49,980 --> 00:22:52,980
There was no same to Shittison.

302
00:22:52,980 --> 00:22:56,980
And we'd nicknamed her power.

303
00:22:56,980 --> 00:22:59,980
He would have her to come up in the midst of one of his meetings.

304
00:22:59,980 --> 00:23:04,980
And she used to say, the man got power.

305
00:23:04,980 --> 00:23:08,980
The man got power, y'all.

306
00:23:08,980 --> 00:23:11,980
And the whole place would just go wild.

307
00:23:14,980 --> 00:23:16,980
Take your glasses off.

308
00:23:16,980 --> 00:23:19,980
Just just dare in our face.

309
00:23:21,980 --> 00:23:26,980
Now, look at my face.

310
00:23:26,980 --> 00:23:28,980
I love you.

311
00:23:28,980 --> 00:23:30,980
The people of you.

312
00:23:30,980 --> 00:23:33,980
Most importantly, Christ loves you.

313
00:23:33,980 --> 00:23:35,980
What do you see?

314
00:23:35,980 --> 00:23:37,980
One thing, one thing you're...

315
00:23:40,980 --> 00:23:45,980
One of the most incredible healings to me was this little old lady.

316
00:23:45,980 --> 00:23:47,980
And she was in a wheelchair.

317
00:23:47,980 --> 00:23:49,980
Jim said, darling, you know, today is your day.

318
00:23:49,980 --> 00:23:53,980
We're going to get healed today.

319
00:23:53,980 --> 00:23:56,980
So we're going to heal those legs of yours.

320
00:23:56,980 --> 00:23:58,980
You're going to walk again.

321
00:23:58,980 --> 00:24:02,980
And the whole auditorium went totally crazy.

322
00:24:02,980 --> 00:24:05,980
Come forth, my dude.

323
00:24:05,980 --> 00:24:06,980
Stand up.

324
00:24:06,980 --> 00:24:08,980
Take that step.

325
00:24:08,980 --> 00:24:09,980
Let's hear about it.

326
00:24:09,980 --> 00:24:11,980
Take that step.

327
00:24:11,980 --> 00:24:14,980
And she takes this real slow shaky step.

328
00:24:16,980 --> 00:24:18,980
She said, I can feel it.

329
00:24:18,980 --> 00:24:20,980
He said, yes, I know you can feel it.

330
00:24:20,980 --> 00:24:22,980
Now take your other leg and do it.

331
00:24:22,980 --> 00:24:25,980
And it's another real slow shaky step.

332
00:24:25,980 --> 00:24:27,980
And he says, now I want you to walk toward me.

333
00:24:27,980 --> 00:24:29,980
Move forward.

334
00:24:29,980 --> 00:24:31,980
Move forward.

335
00:24:31,980 --> 00:24:33,980
You can do it.

336
00:24:33,980 --> 00:24:36,980
And she starts taking forward steps.

337
00:24:36,980 --> 00:24:39,980
And pretty soon, she is walking.

338
00:24:39,980 --> 00:24:42,980
And she starts walking up one of the aisles.

339
00:24:45,980 --> 00:24:48,980
And pretty soon, she's running.

340
00:24:48,980 --> 00:24:51,980
Well, by this time, the whole congregation is running down these aisles with us.

341
00:24:51,980 --> 00:24:55,980
We're all just running around the aisle, just hoping and harness up a storm.

342
00:24:55,980 --> 00:25:12,980
Later, I found out that this person that I had seen healed and cried with was really one of the secretaries

343
00:25:13,980 --> 00:25:15,980
made up to look crippled and blind.

344
00:25:15,980 --> 00:25:20,980
Never shall forget what he's done for me.

345
00:25:20,980 --> 00:25:26,980
Oh, what is the hurry?

346
00:25:26,980 --> 00:25:32,980
Oh, what is the hurry?

347
00:25:32,980 --> 00:25:37,980
Oh, what is the hurry?

348
00:25:37,980 --> 00:25:51,980
For those people that hadn't grown up in the apostolic world, Jim would say, you know, I know this is different for you.

349
00:25:51,980 --> 00:26:01,980
But for people to come from extreme religious backgrounds so that I can bring them forward to the message that's so important for all of us today.

350
00:26:01,980 --> 00:26:04,980
And that is activism.

351
00:26:04,980 --> 00:26:07,980
And I need to speak on each person's level.

352
00:26:07,980 --> 00:26:11,980
He's a lot of people, you Christian people coming in, you're so hung up on this Bible.

353
00:26:11,980 --> 00:26:16,980
He's a this black book is held down black people for the last 200 years.

354
00:26:16,980 --> 00:26:18,980
He said, I'm going to show you this has no power.

355
00:26:18,980 --> 00:26:23,980
So he leaned way back, like a football player and he flung it.

356
00:26:23,980 --> 00:26:29,980
And when he flung it and let it go, the place got dead by it.

357
00:26:29,980 --> 00:26:31,980
And he waited until he hit the floor.

358
00:26:31,980 --> 00:26:36,980
He stood and he looked back and forth.

359
00:26:36,980 --> 00:26:42,980
He said, now did you see any lightning coming from the sky and strike me dead?

360
00:26:42,980 --> 00:26:45,980
No, I'm going to help yourself if you're not going to help.

361
00:26:45,980 --> 00:26:48,980
If they leave one of his, I'm going to rest with you.

362
00:26:48,980 --> 00:26:50,980
Nobody's going to die in the sky.

363
00:26:50,980 --> 00:26:52,980
Let's let him hit the floor.

364
00:26:52,980 --> 00:26:57,980
We're going to have to let him hit the floor.

365
00:26:57,980 --> 00:27:01,980
He said, what you need to believe in is what you can see.

366
00:27:01,980 --> 00:27:05,980
He said, if you see me as your friend, I'll be your friend.

367
00:27:05,980 --> 00:27:09,980
As you see me as your father. I'll be your father for those you that don't have a father.

368
00:27:09,980 --> 00:27:13,980
He said, if you see me as your savior, I'll be your savior.

369
00:27:13,980 --> 00:27:17,980
He said, even so, if you see me as your God, I'll be your God.

370
00:27:17,980 --> 00:27:29,980
There I never heard a man.

371
00:27:29,980 --> 00:27:36,980
He's been like this man before.

372
00:27:36,980 --> 00:27:46,980
People left a gym to a level of adoration because many believed that he had healed them of cancer.

373
00:27:46,980 --> 00:27:54,980
Many believed that he had saved their son or daughter from an automobile accident.

374
00:27:54,980 --> 00:28:06,980
There were many reasons for many people to admire, love, excuse, overlook, much of what jumped at it.

375
00:28:16,980 --> 00:28:20,980
I had been in the temple for just a few months.

376
00:28:20,980 --> 00:28:24,980
I was sent backstage and Los Angeles to get something for somebody.

377
00:28:24,980 --> 00:28:25,980
I remember what.

378
00:28:25,980 --> 00:28:28,980
And Jo and happened to be coming out of his room.

379
00:28:28,980 --> 00:28:33,980
He said, hi, Tim, how are you doing? How's it going? How do you like everything so far?

380
00:28:33,980 --> 00:28:37,980
I like it a lot. It's really cool. I don't remember exactly.

381
00:28:37,980 --> 00:28:42,980
He reached up and kind of padded the back of my neck.

382
00:28:42,980 --> 00:28:46,980
And he said, I'll fuck you in the ass if you want.

383
00:28:46,980 --> 00:28:51,980
And I just kind of stammered no, you know, I know.

384
00:28:51,980 --> 00:28:57,980
And he said, well, you know, if you ever want that, that's okay, you know, just let me know.

385
00:28:57,980 --> 00:28:59,980
And we'll do that.

386
00:28:59,980 --> 00:29:03,980
Jim said that all of us were homosexuals.

387
00:29:03,980 --> 00:29:07,980
Everyone except he was the only heterosexual in the planet.

388
00:29:07,980 --> 00:29:11,980
And that the women were all those bands and the guys were all gay.

389
00:29:11,980 --> 00:29:15,980
And so anyone that showed any interest in sex was just compensating.

390
00:29:15,980 --> 00:29:26,980
What he explained to each of us and instruments was that sexual relationships were very selfish.

391
00:29:26,980 --> 00:29:32,980
And they took away from the focus of the church.

392
00:29:32,980 --> 00:29:35,980
And that was to help others.

393
00:29:35,980 --> 00:29:37,980
Jim was not so a bit.

394
00:29:37,980 --> 00:29:43,980
Nobody knew that until perhaps it was their time to find out what he spoke from the pulp.

395
00:29:43,980 --> 00:29:49,980
But wasn't what he, he did behind the scenes.

396
00:29:49,980 --> 00:29:54,980
I remember one night, one of the brothers had stood up and said, you know,

397
00:29:54,980 --> 00:29:59,980
I think everybody that wants father to screw him in a butt,

398
00:29:59,980 --> 00:30:03,980
you need to take a animal first.

399
00:30:03,980 --> 00:30:06,980
I'm telling you the truth, man.

400
00:30:06,980 --> 00:30:09,980
Tell you the truth.

401
00:30:09,980 --> 00:30:16,980
And then the question went on, well, how many of you in here have had him to do that?

402
00:30:16,980 --> 00:30:23,980
And whether they were lying or just following suit, hands of the men just went up around the room.

403
00:30:23,980 --> 00:30:28,980
And I'm sitting there petrified because I'm like, is this what is leading to?

404
00:30:28,980 --> 00:30:30,980
And I'm supposed to get to.

405
00:30:30,980 --> 00:30:36,980
And I'm thinking, hmm, but I played it off like, okay, I'm being cool, okay, if that's where they are.

406
00:30:36,980 --> 00:30:38,980
That's not where I'm at.

407
00:30:38,980 --> 00:30:41,980
I'm thinking, I'm, my wife, I'm happy with my wife.

408
00:30:41,980 --> 00:30:45,980
You know, what I'm sorry with, would this sleep, I'm not getting up anyway?

409
00:30:45,980 --> 00:30:56,980
One of the powerful things that Jim used to keep us do not think was that we were never really allowed

410
00:30:56,980 --> 00:30:58,980
to speak with one another.

411
00:30:58,980 --> 00:31:02,980
I'd look around and I'd say, I'm only one that feels this way.

412
00:31:02,980 --> 00:31:10,980
I learned eventually not to, not to say anything to anyone.

413
00:31:10,980 --> 00:31:16,980
We had a lady who visited us so we could go here and was speaking to one of the doors.

414
00:31:16,980 --> 00:31:24,980
She was a member of a prominent church, a pastor's wife, and she said, I think that the poor should be made to control how many children they bring in the earth.

415
00:31:24,980 --> 00:31:29,980
If you remember, some leading scientists say we have to have youth in Asia.

416
00:31:29,980 --> 00:31:31,980
Oh, no.

417
00:31:31,980 --> 00:31:32,980
Oh, no.

418
00:31:32,980 --> 00:31:36,980
Who's going to decide who and when a person's going to die?

419
00:31:36,980 --> 00:31:42,980
We must never allow that because this is the kind of thing that usher's in the terror of a Hitler's Germany.

420
00:31:42,980 --> 00:31:45,980
We must not allow these kind of things, they either are consciousness.

421
00:31:45,980 --> 00:31:58,980
My buddies have told me that people's lives, 60% of people's lives were made on emotional decisions.

422
00:31:58,980 --> 00:32:03,980
Make your decisions, 60% of your decisions based on logic, fact, and the reason.

423
00:32:03,980 --> 00:32:08,980
And allow emotion to be the secondary motivator.

424
00:32:08,980 --> 00:32:12,980
And we were star track fans, he and I were star track fans.

425
00:32:12,980 --> 00:32:15,980
And he started to say, just Vulcanize yourself.

426
00:32:15,980 --> 00:32:19,980
Just Vulcanize yourself.

427
00:32:23,980 --> 00:32:26,980
We were celebrating New Year's Eve.

428
00:32:26,980 --> 00:32:29,980
There were about 120 people.

429
00:32:29,980 --> 00:32:33,980
Jim started talking about our cause.

430
00:32:33,980 --> 00:32:40,980
And he said, this punch is going to be passed out to everybody here.

431
00:32:41,980 --> 00:32:43,980
We all drank our punch.

432
00:32:43,980 --> 00:32:48,980
And then he said, you just drank poison.

433
00:32:48,980 --> 00:32:54,980
And we're all die right here in the church together as one.

434
00:32:54,980 --> 00:32:59,980
The women were just screaming, oh, no, my baby, my baby.

435
00:32:59,980 --> 00:33:02,980
And others just sat there.

436
00:33:02,980 --> 00:33:09,980
And all of a sudden Jim says, that wasn't poison you drank.

437
00:33:10,980 --> 00:33:13,980
Jim said that this was a test of loyalty.

438
00:33:13,980 --> 00:33:19,980
He just wanted to see if we were truly committed to our cause.

439
00:33:19,980 --> 00:33:22,980
And that was how we would show it.

440
00:33:22,980 --> 00:33:28,980
Well, it wasn't about our loyalty because we were demonstrating loyalty all the time.

441
00:33:28,980 --> 00:33:34,980
Coming there, being there in the meetings, setting, listening, you know, supporting working.

442
00:33:34,980 --> 00:33:43,980
And I thought it had a lot more to do with Jim's sense of rehearsal.

443
00:33:43,980 --> 00:33:53,980
Did he feel like he was potent and omnipotent enough to really get people to kill themselves when he said so.

444
00:33:53,980 --> 00:33:56,980
And that frightened the hell out of me.

445
00:34:05,980 --> 00:34:18,980
Jim Jones, I think, realized that ultimately, you Kaiah was not the sort of climate where people's temple would thrive.

446
00:34:18,980 --> 00:34:23,980
He wasn't going to be gaining large numbers of members.

447
00:34:23,980 --> 00:34:30,980
He couldn't declare himself to be the socialist god openly, certainly, in a city like you Kaiah.

448
00:34:35,980 --> 00:34:48,980
And San Francisco, Jones walked in on a sort of a wild kind of party where there was a lot of new faces and new sources of power.

449
00:34:48,980 --> 00:34:56,980
And there was a sort of feeling that smaller groups, neighborhood groups, active groups had a bigger chance.

450
00:34:56,980 --> 00:35:00,980
I think the early 60s had been a time of great optimism.

451
00:35:00,980 --> 00:35:05,980
There was a belief that we could change the world through social movements.

452
00:35:05,980 --> 00:35:11,980
With various assassinations, Malcolm X, Metger Evers, Martin Luther King, Robert Kennedy,

453
00:35:11,980 --> 00:35:16,980
there was definitely a feeling of hopelessness.

454
00:35:16,980 --> 00:35:25,980
The message of people's temple was now, the dream is alive.

455
00:35:26,980 --> 00:35:39,980
If you had a demonstration in San Francisco, and you wanted to people to show up, Jim Jones, that people's temple could be there in 20 minutes with hundreds of people.

456
00:35:39,980 --> 00:35:44,980
And we would be enthusiastic.

457
00:35:44,980 --> 00:35:48,980
There was an attitude of we can change the world.

458
00:35:48,980 --> 00:35:51,980
And that's what we wanted to do.

459
00:35:52,980 --> 00:35:55,980
These people would be on time. They'd be polite and nice.

460
00:35:55,980 --> 00:36:01,980
They were a span of ages, a span of races. They were a tailor made for a political rally.

461
00:36:01,980 --> 00:36:06,980
To a politician was like a birthday cake times 12.

462
00:36:06,980 --> 00:36:12,980
You have managed to make the many persons associated with people's temple part of a family.

463
00:36:12,980 --> 00:36:14,980
If you're in need of health care, you've got to health care.

464
00:36:14,980 --> 00:36:17,980
If you're in need of legal assistance of some sort, you get that.

465
00:36:17,980 --> 00:36:19,980
If you're in need of transportation, you get that.

466
00:36:19,980 --> 00:36:24,980
And that's the kind of religious thing that I'm excited about, and have some respect for.

467
00:36:24,980 --> 00:36:35,980
When Vice Presidential candidate Walter Mondale came to San Francisco, Jim Jones was part of the entourage that boarded his private jet.

468
00:36:35,980 --> 00:36:43,980
When Rosalind Carter came to San Francisco, she gave Jim Jones a private audience.

469
00:36:43,980 --> 00:36:51,980
Jim Jones had political power that few people let alone preachers could have imagined.

470
00:36:58,980 --> 00:37:03,980
Jim Jones represented the people's temple as a progressive movement that was threatened,

471
00:37:03,980 --> 00:37:08,980
that there were outside forces who didn't want us to do what we were doing.

472
00:37:08,980 --> 00:37:10,980
And it was the government.

473
00:37:11,980 --> 00:37:18,980
The government was infiltrating and wiretapping and trying to kill people or assassinate people.

474
00:37:18,980 --> 00:37:21,980
That's what was happening.

475
00:37:22,980 --> 00:37:26,980
He was always paranoid that someone was going to get in and try to kill him.

476
00:37:26,980 --> 00:37:35,980
That they had two people that had dedicated their lives that they were going to jump in front of Jones and take the bullet kind of like the secret service to the speed.

477
00:37:36,980 --> 00:37:40,980
Jim started changing a lot in the 70s. He was taking drugs.

478
00:37:40,980 --> 00:37:43,980
I think he said it was his kidneys at the time.

479
00:37:43,980 --> 00:37:46,980
And he was getting more and more paranoid.

480
00:37:46,980 --> 00:37:48,980
Incredibly paranoid.

481
00:37:48,980 --> 00:37:53,980
It was always threats. Always always always always threats.

482
00:37:53,980 --> 00:37:58,980
They were there. They were just about to try to destroy us.

483
00:37:58,980 --> 00:38:03,980
We weren't always diligent about our movement.

484
00:38:05,980 --> 00:38:10,980
There was a fire in the San Francisco temple.

485
00:38:10,980 --> 00:38:14,980
The temple was burned down and had to be rebuilt.

486
00:38:14,980 --> 00:38:18,980
The fire proved they are out to get us.

487
00:38:18,980 --> 00:38:21,980
They so don't want us to do what we're doing. They burned down the temple.

488
00:38:21,980 --> 00:38:24,980
They'll do anything to keep us from doing what we're doing.

489
00:38:24,980 --> 00:38:26,980
So we have to be even stronger.

490
00:38:26,980 --> 00:38:31,980
What about the fact that the Cuckerschlan has increased 100 times in its membership?

491
00:38:31,980 --> 00:38:35,980
Well, not Mississippi. I'm talking about New York State.

492
00:38:35,980 --> 00:38:40,980
It's the church's duty to have a place of protection for its people.

493
00:38:44,980 --> 00:38:52,980
December of 75, 90 of us went by plane in the Gaian and saw where we were building the community there.

494
00:38:52,980 --> 00:38:55,980
They've made progress on the road and level it.

495
00:38:55,980 --> 00:38:59,980
The period of five miles that you're seeing in the distance,

496
00:38:59,980 --> 00:39:03,980
how's it going to be built?

497
00:39:03,980 --> 00:39:11,980
What I saw decoration as being was building a city where we could move and raise our children

498
00:39:11,980 --> 00:39:17,980
outside of the oppression and the racism of the United States of America.

499
00:39:17,980 --> 00:39:25,980
When I first went into Jones town, it was just a footpath in the rainforest.

500
00:39:25,980 --> 00:39:33,980
We had Indians in front of us with machetes and we had a bandian behind us with machetes.

501
00:39:33,980 --> 00:39:43,980
300 miles into the jungle. We literally built a city in the middle of the jungle in the middle of nowhere.

502
00:39:44,980 --> 00:39:49,980
Hello, family. It's such a joy and great pleasure being here because of Father's love.

503
00:39:49,980 --> 00:39:54,980
We are trying to make and we are making a place of refuge for all of you here.

504
00:39:54,980 --> 00:40:00,980
There's nothing at all that I would have any holdings there.

505
00:40:00,980 --> 00:40:05,980
I do not want to go back in any way, shape or form to the states.

506
00:40:05,980 --> 00:40:09,980
I love it here and this is the place where all of you are going to be.

507
00:40:13,980 --> 00:40:21,980
We are seeing a film footage of the first crew that went down there.

508
00:40:21,980 --> 00:40:27,980
We all wanted to go. I wanted to go. It looked like freedom.

509
00:40:27,980 --> 00:40:31,980
We are having family this week.

510
00:40:32,980 --> 00:40:39,980
Now we will each of you give a very fond and grace.

511
00:40:39,980 --> 00:40:47,980
A salutary kiss of greeting to your neighbor. Let's fill this atmosphere with warmth.

512
00:40:47,980 --> 00:40:53,980
We thought of ourselves this one big family that did handle our own discipline.

513
00:40:54,980 --> 00:40:59,980
I was in a lot of the meetings where people were spanked or beaten.

514
00:40:59,980 --> 00:41:04,980
And I was slapped once also in a public meeting.

515
00:41:04,980 --> 00:41:13,980
People were brought up front and asked to have to tell who they had slept with and who they had snicked off to a restaurant with.

516
00:41:13,980 --> 00:41:21,980
It wasn't a week that would bite it. I wouldn't call it up on the floor because it might behave you because it might add to the family claim.

517
00:41:21,980 --> 00:41:23,980
I'm a friend of the family.

518
00:41:23,980 --> 00:41:25,980
I'm a friend of the family.

519
00:41:25,980 --> 00:41:27,980
I'm a friend of the family.

520
00:41:27,980 --> 00:41:29,980
I'm a friend of the family.

521
00:41:29,980 --> 00:41:31,980
I'm a friend of the family.

522
00:41:31,980 --> 00:41:33,980
I'm a friend of the family.

523
00:41:33,980 --> 00:41:35,980
I'm a friend of the family.

524
00:41:35,980 --> 00:41:37,980
I'm a friend of the family.

525
00:41:37,980 --> 00:41:39,980
I'm a friend of the family.

526
00:41:39,980 --> 00:41:41,980
I'm a friend of the family.

527
00:41:41,980 --> 00:41:43,980
I'm a friend of the family.

528
00:41:43,980 --> 00:41:45,980
I'm a friend of the family.

529
00:41:45,980 --> 00:41:47,980
I'm a friend of the family.

530
00:41:47,980 --> 00:41:49,980
I'm a friend of the family.

531
00:41:49,980 --> 00:41:51,980
I'm a friend of the family.

532
00:41:51,980 --> 00:41:53,980
I'm a friend of the family.

533
00:41:53,980 --> 00:41:55,980
I'm a friend of the family.

534
00:41:55,980 --> 00:41:57,980
I'm a friend of the family.

535
00:41:57,980 --> 00:41:59,980
I'm a friend of the family.

536
00:41:59,980 --> 00:42:01,980
I'm a friend of the family.

537
00:42:01,980 --> 00:42:03,980
I'm a friend of the family.

538
00:42:03,980 --> 00:42:05,980
I'm a friend of the family.

539
00:42:05,980 --> 00:42:07,980
I'm a friend of the family.

540
00:42:07,980 --> 00:42:09,980
I'm a friend of the family.

541
00:42:09,980 --> 00:42:11,980
I'm a friend of the family.

542
00:42:11,980 --> 00:42:13,980
I'm a friend of the family.

543
00:42:13,980 --> 00:42:15,980
I'm a friend of the family.

544
00:42:15,980 --> 00:42:17,980
I'm a friend of the family.

545
00:42:17,980 --> 00:42:19,980
I'm a friend of the family.

546
00:42:19,980 --> 00:42:21,980
I'm a friend of the family.

547
00:42:21,980 --> 00:42:23,980
I'm a friend of the family.

548
00:42:23,980 --> 00:42:25,980
I'm a friend of the family.

549
00:42:25,980 --> 00:42:27,980
I'm a friend of the family.

550
00:42:27,980 --> 00:42:29,980
I'm a friend of the family.

551
00:42:29,980 --> 00:42:31,980
I'm a friend of the family.

552
00:42:31,980 --> 00:42:33,980
I'm a friend of the family.

553
00:42:33,980 --> 00:42:35,980
I'm a friend of the family.

554
00:42:35,980 --> 00:42:37,980
I'm a friend of the family.

555
00:42:37,980 --> 00:42:39,980
I'm a friend of the family.

556
00:42:39,980 --> 00:42:41,980
I'm a friend of the family.

557
00:42:41,980 --> 00:42:43,980
I'm a friend of the family.

558
00:42:43,980 --> 00:42:45,980
I'm a friend of the family.

559
00:42:45,980 --> 00:42:47,980
I'm just sitting there calmly.

560
00:42:47,980 --> 00:42:49,980
I don't know why you keep doing that.

561
00:42:49,980 --> 00:42:53,980
What makes you think you got something that he wants anyway?

562
00:42:53,980 --> 00:42:57,980
You know what you ought to just take off your clothes and show them what you got.

563
00:42:57,980 --> 00:42:59,980
You're ain't got nothing.

564
00:42:59,980 --> 00:43:03,980
By this time, they look back to Jones and he looks over his glasses.

565
00:43:03,980 --> 00:43:05,980
He nods with approval.

566
00:43:05,980 --> 00:43:07,980
That's a good idea.

567
00:43:07,980 --> 00:43:09,980
She was to be totally naked.

568
00:43:09,980 --> 00:43:13,980
She was down to nothing but her skin.

569
00:43:13,980 --> 00:43:15,980
She's not even any shoes on.

570
00:43:15,980 --> 00:43:17,980
No bra and no panties and nothing.

571
00:43:17,980 --> 00:43:21,980
Then they begin to say what a breast look like or stomach.

572
00:43:21,980 --> 00:43:23,980
But the giant, you name it.

573
00:43:23,980 --> 00:43:25,980
Everything they could think of.

574
00:43:25,980 --> 00:43:27,980
They were saying by this time, her face is red.

575
00:43:27,980 --> 00:43:29,980
Her body's almost red from embarrassment.

576
00:43:29,980 --> 00:43:31,980
And I noticed something Jones was sitting.

577
00:43:31,980 --> 00:43:33,980
Looking over his sunglasses.

578
00:43:33,980 --> 00:43:35,980
But he had a smile on his face.

579
00:43:35,980 --> 00:43:39,980
Like he's really enjoying this woman being torn down.

580
00:43:39,980 --> 00:43:41,980
I have a conscious memory.

581
00:43:41,980 --> 00:43:45,980
I've said in the earth, thinking to myself, this is wrong.

582
00:43:45,980 --> 00:43:51,980
And I didn't do a damn thing to stand up and say, this is wrong.

583
00:43:51,980 --> 00:43:55,980
It's like a child and a dysfunctional family.

584
00:43:55,980 --> 00:43:59,980
On a certain level, it's normal.

585
00:43:59,980 --> 00:44:01,980
You know?

586
00:44:01,980 --> 00:44:04,980
I just kind of took everything and stride.

587
00:44:04,980 --> 00:44:09,980
But then we felt like we had gotten involved and gotten in so deep that

588
00:44:09,980 --> 00:44:11,980
it was actually no way out.

589
00:44:19,980 --> 00:44:23,980
I had traveled on bus seven, which was Jim's bus.

590
00:44:23,980 --> 00:44:27,980
And he sat down next to me.

591
00:44:27,980 --> 00:44:33,980
And I was sitting there and I thought, that's weird.

592
00:44:33,980 --> 00:44:35,980
He kind of, it smells like alcohol.

593
00:44:35,980 --> 00:44:37,980
Next to me.

594
00:44:38,980 --> 00:44:43,980
And he leaned over and he said, do you know what you do to me?

595
00:44:45,980 --> 00:44:47,980
It informed me that I was to come in.

596
00:44:47,980 --> 00:44:49,980
And on bus seven, there was a room in the back,

597
00:44:49,980 --> 00:44:51,980
which was like a, for just him.

598
00:44:51,980 --> 00:44:55,980
He had books, he had a desk, he had a bed.

599
00:44:55,980 --> 00:44:59,980
When everyone got off the bus at the rest stop,

600
00:44:59,980 --> 00:45:03,980
I went into his little room and I sat there and waited for him.

601
00:45:03,980 --> 00:45:11,980
And finally, he opened the door and, without any talk or anything,

602
00:45:11,980 --> 00:45:17,980
he just pulled out his pants and, and had sex with me.

603
00:45:17,980 --> 00:45:23,980
And as I lay there frightened,

604
00:45:23,980 --> 00:45:29,980
not sure what to do, and as I shivered, he'd say to me,

605
00:45:29,980 --> 00:45:31,980
this is for you.

606
00:45:31,980 --> 00:45:33,980
I'm doing this for you, Debbie.

607
00:45:43,980 --> 00:45:46,980
Well, in 1975, there was a mural election in Serbs,

608
00:45:46,980 --> 00:45:49,980
this could be a conservative candidate and a liberal candidate,

609
00:45:49,980 --> 00:45:50,980
George Moscone.

610
00:45:53,980 --> 00:45:57,980
Jones had several hundred people who would go door to door election day,

611
00:45:57,980 --> 00:46:01,980
instead of a group that might give you 20 or 30 of these people,

612
00:46:01,980 --> 00:46:05,980
or a hundred, you had three or 400.

613
00:46:05,980 --> 00:46:09,980
The Moscone election was very close.

614
00:46:09,980 --> 00:46:13,980
The margin of victory was probably no more than 4,000.

615
00:46:13,980 --> 00:46:17,980
So you had to credit a big chunk of decisive votes to people's temple.

616
00:46:21,980 --> 00:46:24,980
The reward for the election of George Moscone

617
00:46:24,980 --> 00:46:30,980
was the appointment of Jim Jones as chairman of the City Housing Authority.

618
00:46:32,980 --> 00:46:34,980
What was once a really boring meeting.

619
00:46:34,980 --> 00:46:38,980
All of a sudden, it became like really interesting when Jim Jones became the head of it,

620
00:46:38,980 --> 00:46:40,980
because we all came down on the buses,

621
00:46:40,980 --> 00:46:42,980
and we were instructed when Jim came in,

622
00:46:42,980 --> 00:46:46,980
and we stood, and when he left, spoke, we'd stand and clap.

623
00:46:46,980 --> 00:46:52,980
The sheer staginess, the control atmosphere that sort of enclosed this guy,

624
00:46:52,980 --> 00:46:55,980
made him so unusual, so different than the norm,

625
00:46:55,980 --> 00:46:58,980
that it made me very curious.

626
00:47:00,980 --> 00:47:03,980
My biggest problem was getting somebody to talk to me about the church,

627
00:47:03,980 --> 00:47:05,980
and kind of conversational terms.

628
00:47:07,980 --> 00:47:10,980
I had become friends with some of the various defectors,

629
00:47:10,980 --> 00:47:16,980
and one of the defectors told me that she was going to speak publicly about Jones.

630
00:47:16,980 --> 00:47:20,980
And I said to her, I said, well, if you're going to speak publicly,

631
00:47:20,980 --> 00:47:23,980
I'm going to speak with you, I'm not going to let you do this alone.

632
00:47:25,980 --> 00:47:28,980
I finally heard from some ex-members,

633
00:47:28,980 --> 00:47:32,980
who heard I was interested in writing a story about the temple for a new S magazine.

634
00:47:32,980 --> 00:47:35,980
And they took a chance at call me, and some of them said, you know,

635
00:47:35,980 --> 00:47:39,980
you don't know nothing about the church. We don't tell you what I went through.

636
00:47:41,980 --> 00:47:47,980
Before the article was going to break, Jim convinced the publisher that she needed to read it to him.

637
00:47:47,980 --> 00:47:51,980
He was on one phone, and I was on taping the other end of it,

638
00:47:51,980 --> 00:47:53,980
while somebody else listened on another one.

639
00:47:54,980 --> 00:48:01,980
Jim didn't understand that there was no way he could talk her down from whatever this article was going to say.

640
00:48:02,980 --> 00:48:06,980
And as she continues to read this article, he's looking around the room at about five of us,

641
00:48:06,980 --> 00:48:09,980
and you could tell that he's becoming more and more anxious and has,

642
00:48:09,980 --> 00:48:12,980
and, you know, his mouth becomes drier and drier.

643
00:48:12,980 --> 00:48:17,980
And he realizes that this article is going to be hugely damning.

644
00:48:18,980 --> 00:48:22,980
And it was midway through it. He mowed all of us in the room,

645
00:48:22,980 --> 00:48:23,980
we're leaving tonight.

646
00:48:24,980 --> 00:48:29,980
They flew out to Guyana, six hours before that article was going to hit him.

647
00:48:42,980 --> 00:48:58,980
When Jim Jones decided that there was too much pressure, too much trouble to stay in San Francisco,

648
00:48:58,980 --> 00:49:05,980
he ordered the move to Jones Town, and it happened almost overnight.

649
00:49:06,980 --> 00:49:09,980
People were being taken to airports.

650
00:49:10,980 --> 00:49:16,980
There were people who were packing their belongings and leaving their homes with,

651
00:49:16,980 --> 00:49:22,980
virtually no explanation to their family members as to where they were going,

652
00:49:22,980 --> 00:49:23,980
or why they were going.

653
00:49:25,980 --> 00:49:31,980
Fred Lewis came home and found that his wife had taken their seven children

654
00:49:31,980 --> 00:49:35,980
and gone to Guyana, along with all their possessions.

655
00:49:38,980 --> 00:49:41,980
My wife had gone over three months prior.

656
00:49:41,980 --> 00:49:47,980
That was waiting on Pins and Needles, and I was talking to her probably twice a week on the ham radio.

657
00:49:47,980 --> 00:49:52,980
And Leon of Collier, Kimber's OK, you're getting a share of time.

658
00:49:52,980 --> 00:49:53,980
You're going over it.

659
00:49:54,980 --> 00:50:00,980
Coming into Jones Town, we see a guard at the front gate, and you're all excited.

660
00:50:00,980 --> 00:50:02,980
You're going down this road.

661
00:50:02,980 --> 00:50:06,980
To trailer, come to a stop, and then you can see the wooden path we're at,

662
00:50:06,980 --> 00:50:07,980
at least to the pavilion.

663
00:50:07,980 --> 00:50:12,980
And you're just, you want to run, but you just try to climb, we'll be cool.

664
00:50:12,980 --> 00:50:16,980
And just as you reached the edge to the vignan, people started rushing you,

665
00:50:16,980 --> 00:50:18,980
that you knew, you know, my wife is there.

666
00:50:19,980 --> 00:50:23,980
I haven't seen my mother in over a year or so, and I'm just hugging people,

667
00:50:23,980 --> 00:50:28,980
and it's just, it's like I have arrived, and it's, everything's going to be OK now.

668
00:50:43,980 --> 00:50:47,980
I've never been so, totally, happy or fulfilled in my life.

669
00:50:47,980 --> 00:50:48,980
I can't begin to describe it.

670
00:50:48,980 --> 00:50:51,980
You could sit here and talk all day long, and no words could describe the piece,

671
00:50:51,980 --> 00:50:56,980
the beauty, the sense of accomplishment, and responsibility, and camaraderie that's here.

672
00:50:56,980 --> 00:51:00,980
It's, it's overwhelming, it really is, you can't describe it.

673
00:51:00,980 --> 00:51:03,980
You know, it's just, it's an exciting time.

674
00:51:03,980 --> 00:51:09,980
Everything was new and unique, and, and just fun, you know, we just had fun with it as it grew.

675
00:51:09,980 --> 00:51:17,980
I just love that we created what we ate, that we did all these jobs.

676
00:51:17,980 --> 00:51:23,980
What do you think about your friends, about down in the state?

677
00:51:23,980 --> 00:51:25,980
Do you think this should be here?

678
00:51:25,980 --> 00:51:28,980
Well, do you want to show what I'm just morning?

679
00:51:28,980 --> 00:51:29,980
Speak out.

680
00:51:29,980 --> 00:51:30,980
I wish that could.

681
00:51:30,980 --> 00:51:31,980
Well, can you do it?

682
00:51:31,980 --> 00:51:32,980
Yeah, with them.

683
00:51:32,980 --> 00:51:33,980
What do you do?

684
00:51:33,980 --> 00:51:34,980
They won't listen to me.

685
00:51:34,980 --> 00:51:36,980
You won't listen to your heart.

686
00:51:37,980 --> 00:51:41,980
When you don't have anything, you own John's.

687
00:51:41,980 --> 00:51:42,980
You are a part of John's.

688
00:51:42,980 --> 00:51:44,980
You were a shareholder.

689
00:51:44,980 --> 00:51:47,980
A John's type, you were an African-American.

690
00:51:47,980 --> 00:51:51,980
You gave an opportunity to, to really be a part of the create,

691
00:51:51,980 --> 00:51:52,980
now you told me.

692
00:51:52,980 --> 00:51:56,980
Tell me why I told you, don't you want to tell me why.

693
00:51:56,980 --> 00:51:59,980
Why can't we live together?

694
00:52:01,980 --> 00:52:04,980
Tell me why I tell me why.

695
00:52:05,980 --> 00:52:07,980
Why can't we live together?

696
00:52:10,980 --> 00:52:13,980
Everybody wants to live together.

697
00:52:13,980 --> 00:52:15,980
Why can't we live together?

698
00:52:15,980 --> 00:52:19,980
I think that Jim Jones took his group down there,

699
00:52:19,980 --> 00:52:24,980
because he was afraid to base the publicity and answer the questions here in this country.

700
00:52:24,980 --> 00:52:27,980
I don't think that he feels confident.

701
00:52:27,980 --> 00:52:29,980
Having people who are not interested in the country,

702
00:52:29,980 --> 00:52:31,980
he's not interested in the country.

703
00:52:31,980 --> 00:52:33,980
I think that Jim Jones took his group down there,

704
00:52:33,980 --> 00:52:36,980
because he was afraid to base the publicity and answer the questions here in this country.

705
00:52:36,980 --> 00:52:39,980
I don't think that he feels confident.

706
00:52:40,980 --> 00:52:43,980
Having people talk to their relatives,

707
00:52:43,980 --> 00:52:45,980
I think the only way he can survive,

708
00:52:45,980 --> 00:52:47,980
sustain what he started,

709
00:52:47,980 --> 00:52:51,980
disillade all his followers from this country and from their families.

710
00:52:51,980 --> 00:52:56,980
The concern really is where the ex-members who wanted other family members

711
00:52:56,980 --> 00:52:58,980
still in the church to know they could leave.

712
00:52:58,980 --> 00:53:01,980
They wanted them to feel that there was an outside world

713
00:53:01,980 --> 00:53:05,980
that Jones was wrong about telling people they couldn't really leave the church

714
00:53:05,980 --> 00:53:07,980
and that they treated the band.

715
00:53:07,980 --> 00:53:10,980
The church and that they treated badly in the real world.

716
00:53:10,980 --> 00:53:16,980
The concern relative prompted FCC investigation of people's temple.

717
00:53:16,980 --> 00:53:20,980
They organized letter writing campaigns to public officials,

718
00:53:20,980 --> 00:53:21,980
to members of Congress.

719
00:53:21,980 --> 00:53:29,980
They were incredibly effective in mobilizing government and media interest in people's temple.

720
00:53:29,980 --> 00:53:30,980
He was talking in a great way,

721
00:53:30,980 --> 00:53:34,980
and he was talking in helping people who was talking better to this and better that.

722
00:53:35,980 --> 00:53:38,980
What about now, what's your impression of that?

723
00:53:38,980 --> 00:53:43,980
My impression now that those are friends for him.

724
00:53:43,980 --> 00:53:45,980
I think he's gone crazy.

725
00:53:52,980 --> 00:53:58,980
When Jim Jones wasn't there, things tended to be a little bit lighter.

726
00:53:58,980 --> 00:54:03,980
People would be dancing or singing, there'd be music in different cottages.

727
00:54:05,980 --> 00:54:09,980
But when Jones was present, it was very, very dark.

728
00:54:09,980 --> 00:54:11,980
It was almost like a dark cloud.

729
00:54:15,980 --> 00:54:18,980
In Jones town, there is a speaker system,

730
00:54:18,980 --> 00:54:20,980
and only Jim spoke on it,

731
00:54:20,980 --> 00:54:23,980
and it went 24 hours a day,

732
00:54:23,980 --> 00:54:25,980
and he would tape himself.

733
00:54:25,980 --> 00:54:27,980
So in the middle of the night,

734
00:54:27,980 --> 00:54:30,980
his voice was talking to you.

735
00:54:30,980 --> 00:54:33,980
The United States is calling for the removal of all blacks,

736
00:54:33,980 --> 00:54:35,980
and it didn't so always England,

737
00:54:35,980 --> 00:54:40,980
and want to have their immigrant population removed in six months.

738
00:54:40,980 --> 00:54:44,980
We had no other radio or TV or communication with Paris

739
00:54:44,980 --> 00:54:50,980
or any kind of update that could show us

740
00:54:50,980 --> 00:54:52,980
really that there's a whole other thing going on,

741
00:54:52,980 --> 00:54:55,980
besides what Jim was interpreting for us.

742
00:54:55,980 --> 00:54:57,980
I make my stand clear.

743
00:54:57,980 --> 00:55:01,980
Give us our liberty, or give us our death.

744
00:55:01,980 --> 00:55:04,980
No matter where you were, you could hear.

745
00:55:04,980 --> 00:55:08,980
You could hear it in your bunk at night.

746
00:55:08,980 --> 00:55:11,980
You could hear it when you're in the outhouse.

747
00:55:11,980 --> 00:55:15,980
You could hear it when you were working in the field.

748
00:55:15,980 --> 00:55:19,980
You could hear it all the time.

749
00:55:19,980 --> 00:55:22,980
At least on those terms, we choose our death,

750
00:55:22,980 --> 00:55:24,980
and no one chooses it for us.

751
00:55:24,980 --> 00:55:26,980
Don't try to take any of our children.

752
00:55:27,980 --> 00:55:31,980
There was this pervasive sense of being under attack

753
00:55:31,980 --> 00:55:32,980
in Georgetown.

754
00:55:32,980 --> 00:55:35,980
He told them that things were just getting worse

755
00:55:35,980 --> 00:55:36,980
in the United States.

756
00:55:36,980 --> 00:55:38,980
They couldn't go back home.

757
00:55:38,980 --> 00:55:42,980
And not only that, but these forces were traveling to Guyana

758
00:55:42,980 --> 00:55:44,980
to destroy them there.

759
00:55:44,980 --> 00:55:47,980
We can't know how much of this is going on.

760
00:55:47,980 --> 00:55:49,980
They need economics.

761
00:55:49,980 --> 00:55:50,980
Who knows what it is.

762
00:55:50,980 --> 00:55:52,980
I'm not even certain about them,

763
00:55:52,980 --> 00:55:53,980
but I do know what you mean.

764
00:55:54,980 --> 00:55:56,980
So obvious at Martin Luther King.

765
00:55:56,980 --> 00:55:57,980
I'm not going to be scared.

766
00:55:57,980 --> 00:55:58,980
Stop him, there.

767
00:55:58,980 --> 00:56:02,980
Over the summer of 1978, all of us noticed the gym

768
00:56:02,980 --> 00:56:04,980
was seem to be getting sicker.

769
00:56:04,980 --> 00:56:06,980
His herrings over the loudspeaker,

770
00:56:06,980 --> 00:56:09,980
were getting more and more frantic,

771
00:56:09,980 --> 00:56:12,980
and really just sounding more and more insane.

772
00:56:12,980 --> 00:56:15,980
He had gotten to the place that even his voice

773
00:56:15,980 --> 00:56:17,980
was becoming heard.

774
00:56:17,980 --> 00:56:21,980
He said it would be because the nurse

775
00:56:21,980 --> 00:56:24,980
was giving him the long medications,

776
00:56:24,980 --> 00:56:29,980
but yet instilled every day, it was getting worse and worse.

777
00:56:29,980 --> 00:56:31,980
Every night, at some point,

778
00:56:31,980 --> 00:56:33,980
his voice would come over the loudspeaker

779
00:56:33,980 --> 00:56:34,980
and he'd say,

780
00:56:34,980 --> 00:56:36,980
I'm sending somebody out tonight.

781
00:56:36,980 --> 00:56:38,980
Somebody know,

782
00:56:38,980 --> 00:56:39,980
somebody you trust,

783
00:56:39,980 --> 00:56:42,980
and they're going to act like they want to leave.

784
00:56:42,980 --> 00:56:45,980
But this is a loyalty test,

785
00:56:45,980 --> 00:56:48,980
and you need to turn them in.

786
00:56:49,980 --> 00:56:51,980
A father would turn in a sun,

787
00:56:51,980 --> 00:56:53,980
a husband would turn in a wife,

788
00:56:53,980 --> 00:56:56,980
a small child would turn in a parent.

789
00:56:58,980 --> 00:57:01,980
There was no freedom to express

790
00:57:01,980 --> 00:57:03,980
to one another what was going on

791
00:57:03,980 --> 00:57:06,980
because everything was suspect.

792
00:57:06,980 --> 00:57:12,980
The most forbidden thing to express was to leave.

793
00:57:13,980 --> 00:57:17,980
In a real issue with separation,

794
00:57:17,980 --> 00:57:20,980
people could not leave him.

795
00:57:20,980 --> 00:57:24,980
He took it as a betrayal

796
00:57:24,980 --> 00:57:27,980
to the cause and to get personal.

797
00:57:27,980 --> 00:57:29,980
He said,

798
00:57:29,980 --> 00:57:31,980
I really want to get away from him

799
00:57:31,980 --> 00:57:32,980
by Christmas,

800
00:57:32,980 --> 00:57:33,980
I will be gone.

801
00:57:33,980 --> 00:57:34,980
By Christmas,

802
00:57:34,980 --> 00:57:35,980
you want to be gone?

803
00:57:35,980 --> 00:57:37,980
You want to be gone?

804
00:57:37,980 --> 00:57:39,980
By Christmas,

805
00:57:39,980 --> 00:57:40,980
you want to be gone,

806
00:57:40,980 --> 00:57:42,980
as you could have a woman

807
00:57:42,980 --> 00:57:44,980
make a trip to see my brother.

808
00:57:44,980 --> 00:57:46,980
I have the power to say you own

809
00:57:46,980 --> 00:57:47,980
my Christmas,

810
00:57:47,980 --> 00:57:49,980
but it's not on transfer of airlines.

811
00:57:49,980 --> 00:57:51,980
It's blasphemy.

812
00:57:51,980 --> 00:57:52,980
It's blasphemy

813
00:57:52,980 --> 00:57:54,980
to talk about going back

814
00:57:54,980 --> 00:57:56,980
to you have not been given any approval.

815
00:57:56,980 --> 00:57:58,980
Do you want to go home?

816
00:57:58,980 --> 00:58:00,980
Oh.

817
00:58:00,980 --> 00:58:01,980
Well,

818
00:58:01,980 --> 00:58:02,980
NBC didn't shut your mouth

819
00:58:02,980 --> 00:58:04,980
and don't be in my face anymore.

820
00:58:10,980 --> 00:58:12,980
Congressman Ryan was unique

821
00:58:12,980 --> 00:58:13,980
in the political sphere.

822
00:58:13,980 --> 00:58:15,980
They had this hands-on

823
00:58:15,980 --> 00:58:17,980
approach to legislative.

824
00:58:17,980 --> 00:58:19,980
He just didn't take

825
00:58:19,980 --> 00:58:21,980
no for an answer.

826
00:58:21,980 --> 00:58:22,980
So when he was in the state of

827
00:58:22,980 --> 00:58:24,980
assembly, he went to

828
00:58:24,980 --> 00:58:25,980
full-sum state prison

829
00:58:25,980 --> 00:58:28,980
and spent a week as an inmate

830
00:58:28,980 --> 00:58:30,980
to understand the prison issues

831
00:58:30,980 --> 00:58:32,980
and prison reform.

832
00:58:32,980 --> 00:58:35,980
He became concerned

833
00:58:35,980 --> 00:58:37,980
because a number of

834
00:58:37,980 --> 00:58:39,980
residents in San Mateo County

835
00:58:39,980 --> 00:58:42,980
had become members of the People's Temple

836
00:58:42,980 --> 00:58:44,980
and family members started contacting him.

837
00:58:44,980 --> 00:58:46,980
Concerned about their

838
00:58:46,980 --> 00:58:48,980
whereabouts and concerned about

839
00:58:48,980 --> 00:58:50,980
whether or not they were

840
00:58:50,980 --> 00:58:53,980
being held against their will.

841
00:58:53,980 --> 00:58:54,980
The word we were getting

842
00:58:54,980 --> 00:58:56,980
was that there was an armed

843
00:58:56,980 --> 00:58:59,980
in campment.

844
00:58:59,980 --> 00:59:01,980
It was enough

845
00:59:01,980 --> 00:59:03,980
for the Congressman to say,

846
00:59:03,980 --> 00:59:04,980
you know what?

847
00:59:04,980 --> 00:59:06,980
I want to go find out for myself.

848
00:59:15,980 --> 00:59:16,980
There was a lot of

849
00:59:16,980 --> 00:59:18,980
preparation for Congressman Ryan's

850
00:59:18,980 --> 00:59:19,980
visits.

851
00:59:19,980 --> 00:59:20,980
There was all these

852
00:59:20,980 --> 00:59:22,980
different scenarios

853
00:59:22,980 --> 00:59:24,980
that were presented.

854
00:59:24,980 --> 00:59:26,980
He wasn't going to let him in.

855
00:59:26,980 --> 00:59:28,980
He was going to let him in.

856
00:59:28,980 --> 00:59:29,980
We were going to wait for them to

857
00:59:29,980 --> 00:59:30,980
come in and we were going to

858
00:59:30,980 --> 00:59:32,980
kill him all when they came in.

859
00:59:32,980 --> 00:59:34,980
I was very fearful about making the

860
00:59:34,980 --> 00:59:35,980
trip.

861
00:59:35,980 --> 00:59:37,980
I had a copy of the Congressman's

862
00:59:37,980 --> 00:59:40,980
will and placed it in a

863
00:59:40,980 --> 00:59:42,980
particular door in my desk.

864
00:59:42,980 --> 00:59:45,980
Just in case.

865
00:59:45,980 --> 00:59:49,980
We're flowing sometimes in

866
00:59:49,980 --> 00:59:53,980
the afternoon about six p.m.

867
00:59:53,980 --> 00:59:55,980
We saw this beautiful

868
00:59:55,980 --> 00:59:58,980
size welcome to

869
00:59:58,980 --> 01:00:00:00,980
Jong's town.

870
01:00:00,980 --> 01:00:03,980
As we approached Jong's town,

871
01:00:03,980 --> 01:00:06,980
it was Spartan,

872
01:00:06,980 --> 01:00:09,980
but it was a great place.

873
01:00:09,980 --> 01:00:11,980
I was Spartan, but

874
01:00:11,980 --> 01:00:14,980
very impressive.

875
01:00:14,980 --> 01:00:16,980
How could you not be impressed

876
01:00:16,980 --> 01:00:18,980
that out of the

877
01:00:18,980 --> 01:00:19,980
jungles of Guyana?

878
01:00:19,980 --> 01:00:21,980
They had carved out a

879
01:00:21,980 --> 01:00:23,980
community.

880
01:00:23,980 --> 01:00:25,980
They had crops growing.

881
01:00:25,980 --> 01:00:27,980
They had cabins.

882
01:00:27,980 --> 01:00:28,980
They had a little medical

883
01:00:28,980 --> 01:00:30,980
clinic, a little daycare area.

884
01:00:30,980 --> 01:00:32,980
Power.

885
01:00:32,980 --> 01:00:35,980
Rice, black eyed peas.

886
01:00:35,980 --> 01:00:37,980
More peas.

887
01:00:37,980 --> 01:00:39,980
They had different

888
01:00:39,980 --> 01:00:41,980
containers around the place.

889
01:00:41,980 --> 01:00:43,980
Couldn't go through all the

890
01:00:43,980 --> 01:00:45,980
tremendous inventory.

891
01:00:45,980 --> 01:00:47,980
They built up cool aid.

892
01:00:47,980 --> 01:00:52,980
When rice came,

893
01:00:52,980 --> 01:00:55,980
we came on a Friday night.

894
01:00:55,980 --> 01:00:58,980
We put on a reception

895
01:00:58,980 --> 01:00:59,980
point.

896
01:00:59,980 --> 01:01:01,980
The songs that we sang

897
01:01:01,980 --> 01:01:04,980
that night, it was people saying

898
01:01:04,980 --> 01:01:07,980
this is who we are and this is what we're about.

899
01:01:07,980 --> 01:01:24,980
It was a vibrant community.

900
01:01:24,980 --> 01:01:26,980
I would never imagine

901
01:01:26,980 --> 01:01:28,980
that 24 hours later,

902
01:01:28,980 --> 01:01:30,980
those people would be dead.

903
01:01:30,980 --> 01:01:35,980
We were all in the same place.

904
01:01:35,980 --> 01:01:40,980
We were all in the same place.

905
01:01:40,980 --> 01:01:43,980
We were all in the same place.

906
01:01:43,980 --> 01:01:47,980
We were all in the same place.

907
01:01:47,980 --> 01:01:51,980
We were all in the same place.

908
01:01:51,980 --> 01:01:53,980
Everything up to that point

909
01:01:53,980 --> 01:01:55,980
was good.

910
01:01:55,980 --> 01:01:57,980
Everybody was

911
01:01:57,980 --> 01:01:59,980
in the same place.

912
01:01:59,980 --> 01:02:01,980
We were all in the same place.

913
01:02:01,980 --> 01:02:03,980
We were all in the same place.

914
01:02:03,980 --> 01:02:05,980
We were all in the same place.

915
01:02:05,980 --> 01:02:07,980
We were all in the same place.

916
01:02:07,980 --> 01:02:09,980
We were all in the same place.

917
01:02:09,980 --> 01:02:11,980
We were all in the same place.

918
01:02:11,980 --> 01:02:13,980
We were all in the same place.

919
01:02:13,980 --> 01:02:15,980
We were all in the same place.

920
01:02:15,980 --> 01:02:17,980
We were all in the same place.

921
01:02:17,980 --> 01:02:19,980
We were all in the same place.

922
01:02:19,980 --> 01:02:21,980
We were all in the same place.

923
01:02:21,980 --> 01:02:23,980
We were all in the same place.

924
01:02:23,980 --> 01:02:25,980
We were all in the same place.

925
01:02:26,980 --> 01:02:30,980
That response to him, the spontaneous,

926
01:02:30,980 --> 01:02:33,980
it was loud, it was emotional.

927
01:02:33,980 --> 01:02:39,980
What I was feeling was,

928
01:02:39,980 --> 01:02:42,980
this is an opportunity that I can vocalize

929
01:02:42,980 --> 01:02:46,980
how much I believe in what we are doing here.

930
01:02:46,980 --> 01:02:50,980
The reporter next to me said I've never felt anything like this before.

931
01:02:50,980 --> 01:02:53,980
Because you haven't felt anything like this before.

932
01:02:56,980 --> 01:03:00,980
I actually felt pretty good overall.

933
01:03:00,980 --> 01:03:04,980
This went probably as well as it possibly could go so far.

934
01:03:04,980 --> 01:03:05,980
When Congressman Ryan came, I wanted to pass him a note and said,

935
01:03:05,980 --> 01:03:08,980
help us get out of John's town.

936
01:03:08,980 --> 01:03:12,980
When one of the reporters was walking around the city,

937
01:03:12,980 --> 01:03:14,980
he said,

938
01:03:14,980 --> 01:03:16,980
when one of the reporters was walking around the city,

939
01:03:16,980 --> 01:03:18,980
he said,

940
01:03:18,980 --> 01:03:18,980

941
01:03:18,980 --> 01:03:21,980
help us get out of John's town.

942
01:03:21,980 --> 01:03:24,980
When one of the reporters was walking around the city,

943
01:03:24,980 --> 01:03:25,980
he said,

944
01:03:25,980 --> 01:03:28,980
I was walking around towards the edge of the pavilion.

945
01:03:28,980 --> 01:03:31,980
I stuck the note in a fold of his arm,

946
01:03:31,980 --> 01:03:34,980
and it felt to the ground.

947
01:03:34,980 --> 01:03:36,980
And so I picked up the note,

948
01:03:36,980 --> 01:03:38,980
and I gave it back to him,

949
01:03:38,980 --> 01:03:38,980

950
01:03:38,980 --> 01:03:39,980
you dropped something,

951
01:03:39,980 --> 01:03:41,980
and this little boy about nine years old sort of saying,

952
01:03:41,980 --> 01:03:42,980
he passed a note.

953
01:03:42,980 --> 01:03:46,980
John Harris, who was the NBC reporter,

954
01:03:46,980 --> 01:03:50,980
came up to me and Congressman Ryan,

955
01:03:50,980 --> 01:03:53,980
and handed us these two notes

956
01:03:53,980 --> 01:03:56,980
from people that wanted to leave.

957
01:03:56,980 --> 01:03:58,980
So at that point,

958
01:03:58,980 --> 01:04:03,980
we knew that something was very, very wrong.

959
01:04:17,980 --> 01:04:21,980
I was like the first to rise up

960
01:04:21,980 --> 01:04:24,980
to the following day.

961
01:04:24,980 --> 01:04:27,980
It was a bright sunny day,

962
01:04:27,980 --> 01:04:30,980
but it was a dark day.

963
01:04:30,980 --> 01:04:32,980
It just didn't feel right.

964
01:04:32,980 --> 01:04:33,980
We were there,

965
01:04:33,980 --> 01:04:35,980
supposed to interview some of the family member

966
01:04:35,980 --> 01:04:38,980
to ask them why can't he cannot leave.

967
01:04:38,980 --> 01:04:39,980
Are you happy here?

968
01:04:39,980 --> 01:04:40,980
Oh, I should see.

969
01:04:40,980 --> 01:04:41,980
I haven't.

970
01:04:41,980 --> 01:04:42,980
I've never been any happier in my life.

971
01:04:42,980 --> 01:04:43,980
You want to stay?

972
01:04:43,980 --> 01:04:45,980
Well, definitely.

973
01:04:45,980 --> 01:04:47,980
I certainly do.

974
01:04:47,980 --> 01:04:49,980
You some people have said,

975
01:04:49,980 --> 01:04:51,980
they couldn't leave if they wanted to.

976
01:04:51,980 --> 01:04:52,980
Are you thinking, cut?

977
01:04:52,980 --> 01:04:54,980
Yeah, if I really wanted to,

978
01:04:54,980 --> 01:04:55,980
I'm really glad.

979
01:04:55,980 --> 01:04:56,980
I was really,

980
01:04:56,980 --> 01:04:59,980
and you really wanted to have you have to feel it out.

981
01:04:59,980 --> 01:05:00,980
Well, I believe it.

982
01:05:00,980 --> 01:05:01,980
I've been here a few days,

983
01:05:01,980 --> 01:05:04,980
and I have absolutely no complaints at all.

984
01:05:04,980 --> 01:05:06,980
It is really nice.

985
01:05:06,980 --> 01:05:07,980
It is really nice.

986
01:05:07,980 --> 01:05:09,980
And I'll be leaving in a couple weeks,

987
01:05:09,980 --> 01:05:11,980
and they could come with me,

988
01:05:11,980 --> 01:05:13,980
but they said they didn't want to come.

989
01:05:13,980 --> 01:05:18,980
Literally out of nowhere,

990
01:05:18,980 --> 01:05:20,980
the storm came blowing in.

991
01:05:20,980 --> 01:05:22,980
The Skytron black,

992
01:05:22,980 --> 01:05:23,980
the wind came up,

993
01:05:23,980 --> 01:05:24,980
and it just,

994
01:05:24,980 --> 01:05:27,980
torrential rain.

995
01:05:27,980 --> 01:05:30,980
But what I personally felt

996
01:05:30,980 --> 01:05:33,980
was that evil itself blew into Jones town.

997
01:05:33,980 --> 01:05:39,980
It was about 1130 in the morning.

998
01:05:39,980 --> 01:05:42,980
Edith Parks walked up to Jackie Spear

999
01:05:42,980 --> 01:05:44,980
and said, I'm being held prisoner here.

1000
01:05:44,980 --> 01:05:46,980
I want to go home.

1001
01:05:46,980 --> 01:05:48,980
I do I both understand you.

1002
01:05:48,980 --> 01:05:50,980
I say that you both wanted Jones town.

1003
01:05:50,980 --> 01:05:54,980
On the stage, you're going to have to send it to you.

1004
01:05:54,980 --> 01:05:57,980
Immediately, the whole vibe stage,

1005
01:05:57,980 --> 01:05:59,980
I mean, you just reporters that we got our story.

1006
01:05:59,980 --> 01:06:01,980
You know, the story here is happening right now.

1007
01:06:01,980 --> 01:06:03,980
Jim Jones came to talk to me.

1008
01:06:03,980 --> 01:06:06,980
And the first thing he said was,

1009
01:06:06,980 --> 01:06:08,980
don't say anything to the reporters.

1010
01:06:08,980 --> 01:06:10,980
They're all liars.

1011
01:06:11,980 --> 01:06:14,980
The last words I heard from Jim Jones was,

1012
01:06:14,980 --> 01:06:17,980
I just want you to know that you can come back

1013
01:06:17,980 --> 01:06:20,980
to Jones town and visit your son anytime you want.

1014
01:06:20,980 --> 01:06:24,980
Last night, someone came and passed me this note.

1015
01:06:24,980 --> 01:06:27,980
He's the one that I'm just talking about.

1016
01:06:27,980 --> 01:06:29,980
Yeah, it was the gentleman.

1017
01:06:29,980 --> 01:06:32,980
This is the man I want to know who's sunny.

1018
01:06:32,980 --> 01:06:34,980
Doesn't concern you, though,

1019
01:06:34,980 --> 01:06:36,980
that this man for whatever reason.

1020
01:06:36,980 --> 01:06:38,980
One of the people in your group,

1021
01:06:38,980 --> 01:06:40,980
people like James,

1022
01:06:40,980 --> 01:06:43,980
a lot, the lot, what can I do about that?

1023
01:06:43,980 --> 01:06:45,980
So you people can leave us,

1024
01:06:45,980 --> 01:06:47,980
I just beg you, please leave us.

1025
01:06:47,980 --> 01:06:49,980
Bill, we will bother nobody,

1026
01:06:49,980 --> 01:06:52,980
anybody wants to get out of here to get out of here.

1027
01:06:52,980 --> 01:06:54,980
We have no problem by getting out of here.

1028
01:06:54,980 --> 01:06:55,980
They're coming through all the time.

1029
01:06:55,980 --> 01:06:57,980
I don't know what kind of game.

1030
01:06:57,980 --> 01:06:59,980
People like people like publicity.

1031
01:06:59,980 --> 01:07:00,980
Some people do.

1032
01:07:00,980 --> 01:07:01,980
I don't.

1033
01:07:01,980 --> 01:07:03,980
Some people like publicity.

1034
01:07:03,980 --> 01:07:04,980
But if it's a damn bad,

1035
01:07:04,980 --> 01:07:06,980
why is he leaving his son here?

1036
01:07:07,980 --> 01:07:09,980
Can you give me good reasons for that?

1037
01:07:09,980 --> 01:07:11,980
When word got out,

1038
01:07:11,980 --> 01:07:14,980
that people were leaving.

1039
01:07:14,980 --> 01:07:16,980
I'll help, bro.

1040
01:07:16,980 --> 01:07:18,980
You're right, those kids back here!

1041
01:07:18,980 --> 01:07:21,980
You're right, you're right, you're right back!

1042
01:07:21,980 --> 01:07:51,980
Don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don

1043
01:07:51,980 --> 01:08:21,980
don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don

1044
01:08:21,980 --> 01:08:51,980
don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don

1045
01:08:51,980 --> 01:09:21,980
don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don

1046
01:09:21,980 --> 01:09:51,980
jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump, don't jump

1047
01:09:51,980 --> 01:09:56,540
when there's an announcement on the loudspeaker, everybody report to the Vivilian for a meeting

1048
01:10:08,860 --> 01:10:11,900
We drove back with two that the Aestric Port-Cathuma

1049
01:10:13,900 --> 01:10:19,100
All of a sudden we saw a dumb truck from far way, arriving to this Aestric

1050
01:10:19,660 --> 01:10:25,420
We realized these people catch up from the people from Jim Jones, they're very close, lieutenant to Jim Jones

1051
01:10:29,180 --> 01:10:34,700
These three guys, they get off the truck walk around this area, that's the way you're looking for somebody

1052
01:10:35,660 --> 01:10:41,020
They're looking people's faces, they stare us a little bit but they didn't say one word, didn't ask anything

1053
01:10:41,660 --> 01:10:43,180
Right away, they walk back to the truck

1054
01:10:44,140 --> 01:10:52,220
They drove this truck all across the Aestrip and stopped on this side of the plane

1055
01:10:52,940 --> 01:10:55,340
So literally they cut us off from the jungle

1056
01:10:58,220 --> 01:11:04,220
We never know those people, and inside the dumb truck, the moment it stopped, they stopped shooting right away

1057
01:11:04,860 --> 01:11:15,180
Everybody ran towards the plane, on the side plane, they tried to hide underneath the wheels

1058
01:11:15,820 --> 01:11:22,380
And the congressman ran under the plane and I sort of followed suit and got behind one of the tires

1059
01:11:25,900 --> 01:11:29,660
All you can hear is a gun pop, pop, pop goes off constantly

1060
01:11:30,780 --> 01:11:33,100
Will lie flat on a time at that moment

1061
01:11:34,540 --> 01:11:37,500
But surely afterwards I heard my partner the cameraman

1062
01:11:38,060 --> 01:11:41,740
He yell oh shit, he said he got hit, he got shot, he was sitting up

1063
01:11:44,940 --> 01:11:50,860
There were people tumbling and yelling and letting out cries as they were hit

1064
01:11:52,540 --> 01:11:54,940
I was hit in my arm and wrist

1065
01:11:56,300 --> 01:11:58,940
I felt a tremendous explosion, my next to my head

1066
01:11:59,900 --> 01:12:03,980
I got to men as a pain ran through my arm and on my shoulder

1067
01:12:05,020 --> 01:12:09,660
I was really shaking by the move, I took the pain and host still

1068
01:12:11,020 --> 01:12:17,820
I was lying on my side pretending that I was dead with my head down and

1069
01:12:23,420 --> 01:12:28,780
They came and shot me at point point blank

1070
01:12:29,020 --> 01:12:31,020
Range

1071
01:12:31,740 --> 01:12:36,540
I remember someone coming to me and telling me the congressman riot was dead

1072
01:12:37,340 --> 01:12:43,420
But I was at a point where I didn't know how much more time I was going to be alive

1073
01:12:48,860 --> 01:12:52,780
The gun's dead and all you can hear is one engine will suit running so all you can't

1074
01:12:52,780 --> 01:12:55,020
Engine noise and that's it

1075
01:12:59,740 --> 01:13:11,260
We walked up to give it all together with everybody else who was very quiet

1076
01:13:11,260 --> 01:13:15,500
It was very somber, it was very sad but it wasn't a death march

1077
01:13:29,900 --> 01:13:31,900
They were going to go to sleep

1078
01:13:33,740 --> 01:13:35,740
We got to go

1079
01:13:36,380 --> 01:13:38,620
We got to get out of here, we got to go to sleep

1080
01:13:39,980 --> 01:13:41,980
Get the solution together

1081
01:13:48,620 --> 01:13:51,900
Maria Ketsera has walked up to him and whispered in his ear and he looked out of his head

1082
01:13:51,900 --> 01:13:53,900
Is there any way to make a taste less bitter

1083
01:13:54,460 --> 01:14:00,380
And she said no, no, apparently not and he said he is a quick and she said

1084
01:14:00,940 --> 01:14:02,940
Yeah, it's supposed to be quick

1085
01:14:15,580 --> 01:14:18,780
Of Jones town Christine Miller stood up and said I don't want to die here

1086
01:14:19,420 --> 01:14:21,900
Why are we going to throw all this away we work too hard

1087
01:14:24,380 --> 01:14:26,380
I

1088
01:14:37,660 --> 01:14:43,260
She's calling Jim Jones on some of the things that he has promised them that they were going to do

1089
01:14:44,700 --> 01:14:50,380
Jim promised that as an alternative to them dying in Jones town that they could go to the survey

1090
01:14:54,220 --> 01:15:01,580
My name is in the call to write to what's more to get eventually the rhetoric wretched's up enough that she is shot it down

1091
01:15:09,500 --> 01:15:11,500
When I noticed that there were armed

1092
01:15:12,380 --> 01:15:14,860
Guards who kind of taken positions up around the pavilion

1093
01:15:15,740 --> 01:15:18,540
I'm thinking where did all these fucking guns come from

1094
01:15:18,940 --> 01:15:22,940
Jones came down

1095
01:15:23,980 --> 01:15:27,180
After podium and he said hey

1096
01:15:28,380 --> 01:15:34,780
We got to do this we got to go that if we don't go this way we're gonna go like this

1097
01:15:37,020 --> 01:15:39,260
They were coming taking like newborn babies

1098
01:15:39,660 --> 01:15:41,660
Others are mothers on

1099
01:15:48,620 --> 01:16:07,180
He's a young kid his name is certainly when he came inside he bumped into me

1100
01:16:08,700 --> 01:16:12,700
At that same time he's fallen to the ground and he's going into convulsion

1101
01:16:18,620 --> 01:16:20,620
I

1102
01:16:22,620 --> 01:16:28,060
Grab the kids from the shoulders up in that process

1103
01:16:28,700 --> 01:16:32,780
I'm taking him out of the pavilion just kid died in my arms

1104
01:16:33,500 --> 01:16:40,300
I mean, I mean, I just I just thought the life go out of it to me at that point

1105
01:16:40,300 --> 01:16:42,300
I knew that this shit was real

1106
01:16:48,700 --> 01:16:50,540
That is definitely only another plane

1107
01:16:54,860 --> 01:16:57,980
I love to use the term suicide and I'm like I'll never you

1108
01:16:58,380 --> 01:17:01,660
Was that that that man killed who's killing us

1109
01:17:03,660 --> 01:17:11,340
As I walk up to the back of the pavilion I saw a woman named Rosie on the ground crying holding her dead baby

1110
01:17:12,300 --> 01:17:16,620
There were maybe eight or nine other people who were dying or in the process of dying

1111
01:17:17,580 --> 01:17:23,820
Inside I just want to things to stop please just let me catch my breath. Let me figure out

1112
01:17:24,780 --> 01:17:26,780
What's happening here

1113
01:17:28,140 --> 01:17:34,220
I look to my right then I saw my wife with our son and her arms and

1114
01:17:35,340 --> 01:17:37,340
Poison being injected into his mouth

1115
01:17:39,420 --> 01:17:42,380
My son was dead and he was frothy net the mouth, you know

1116
01:17:42,380 --> 01:17:44,380
Sinai makes people froth at the mouth

1117
01:17:46,620 --> 01:17:53,100
My wife died in my arms and my dead baby son was in her arms and I held her and said I love you

1118
01:17:53,100 --> 01:17:55,260
I love you I because this all I could say it was like

1119
01:17:59,980 --> 01:18:01,980
She died in my arms

1120
01:18:14,220 --> 01:18:16,220
My wife came up to me

1121
01:18:16,620 --> 01:18:20,060
She didn't have no kids and I actually just was but just in a days

1122
01:18:22,060 --> 01:18:25,660
My mother my grandmother my sister my puppy how they go

1123
01:18:26,860 --> 01:18:33,740
You know, she's it just take me just take me and just lay me down next to my grandmother

1124
01:18:34,780 --> 01:18:39,260
And she went up to that kule to that deaf burrow

1125
01:18:40,300 --> 01:18:46,140
And she just didn't have to just tuck it in and drop it and then told me to hold her to take her and I did

1126
01:18:46,700 --> 01:18:48,700
And she died in my arms

1127
01:18:49,020 --> 01:18:50,700
You know

1128
01:18:50,700 --> 01:18:55,660
And once I lay her down and she told me how she went to lay with her grandmother

1129
01:18:56,220 --> 01:19:01,580
I am at that point move that I have a reason to be here no more

1130
01:19:16,860 --> 01:19:18,860
The name would name one

1131
01:19:24,060 --> 01:19:26,060
You're just fucking slaughtered

1132
01:19:27,660 --> 01:19:29,340
I am fucking slaughtered

1133
01:19:30,780 --> 01:19:35,020
There is nothing dignified about it and nothing new the revolutionary suicide and nothing

1134
01:19:35,020 --> 01:19:41,740
New about making a fucking statement it was just senseless waste senseless waste and death

1135
01:19:46,620 --> 01:19:48,380
To whom ever finds this note

1136
01:19:50,220 --> 01:19:54,940
Collect all the tapes all the writing all the history

1137
01:19:56,380 --> 01:20:02,620
The story of this movement this action must be examined over and over

1138
01:20:04,380 --> 01:20:06,380
We did not want this kind of ending

1139
01:20:07,500 --> 01:20:09,820
We wanted to live to shy

1140
01:20:10,780 --> 01:20:14,620
To bring light to a world that is dying for a little bit of love

1141
01:20:15,020 --> 01:20:21,580
I never believed in heaven in my whole life, you know, that's not the way I operate it but when I was in Gaian

1142
01:20:21,580 --> 01:20:25,180
And when I watched the sunrises of I actually thought there was never another earth

1143
01:20:31,260 --> 01:20:33,260
And now I can't believe in heaven anymore

1144
01:20:34,940 --> 01:20:36,940
There's quiet as we leave this world

1145
01:20:37,980 --> 01:20:39,020
The sky is gray

1146
01:20:40,060 --> 01:20:44,140
People filed by a slowly and take the somewhat bitter drink

1147
01:20:45,500 --> 01:20:47,500
Many more must drink

1148
01:20:48,380 --> 01:20:53,260
I'm saddened because it didn't work out because it just seemed so beautiful

1149
01:20:54,860 --> 01:20:56,700
And I'll say this about November 18

1150
01:20:57,580 --> 01:21:00,540
I felt I'd lost a family

1151
01:21:02,620 --> 01:21:04,300
And I knew I'd lost my children

1152
01:21:06,700 --> 01:21:11,900
A teeny kitten sits next to me watching a dog barks

1153
01:21:12,860 --> 01:21:15,580
The birds gather on the telephone wires

1154
01:21:17,020 --> 01:21:20,540
Let all the story of this people's temple be told

1155
01:21:23,100 --> 01:21:25,740
Are we were people that we want to make a change?

1156
01:21:26,380 --> 01:21:28,380
It's a shame it didn't happen

1157
01:21:28,380 --> 01:21:30,380
It might not never happen

1158
01:21:31,180 --> 01:21:37,900
But one thing I can't say at least we tried and we didn't sit back and wait on the laurels of somebody else to try it

1159
01:21:38,220 --> 01:21:40,940
Yes, we tried it. Yes, it was a failure

1160
01:21:41,420 --> 01:21:43,420
Yes, it was very tragic

1161
01:21:43,660 --> 01:21:45,660
But at least we tried

1162
01:21:48,220 --> 01:21:51,580
If nobody understands it matters not

1163
01:21:53,020 --> 01:21:54,460
I'm ready to die now

1164
01:21:56,060 --> 01:22:01,180
Darkness settles over Jones town on its last day on earth

1165
01:22:02,940 --> 01:22:05,100
I'd never had any dreams of Jones town

1166
01:22:06,140 --> 01:22:07,660
Until this one dream came

1167
01:22:08,620 --> 01:22:14,700
I could see myself in Jones town walking and when I looked to my left there was my son

1168
01:22:16,700 --> 01:22:23,500
He was standing in the middle of a duffel bag and just right when I got ready to reach the touches head

1169
01:22:23,900 --> 01:22:28,460
He pulled the bag up like this in the back fell and he was gone

1170
01:25:37,740 --> 01:25:40,700
I'm going to tell you about the new story

1171
01:25:44,940 --> 01:25:47,740
There's more at American Experience Online

1172
01:25:47,740 --> 01:25:51,740
Visit Companion website for each American Experience episode

1173
01:25:51,740 --> 01:25:56,460
With interactive features, additional interviews, plus rare videos and photos

1174
01:25:56,460 --> 01:25:59,180
All this and more at pbs.org

1175
01:26:01,180 --> 01:26:06,140
Major funding for American Experience is provided by the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation

1176
01:26:06,780 --> 01:26:11,500
National corporate funding is provided by Liberty Mutual and the Scotts Company

1177
01:26:12,460 --> 01:26:15,580
Additional funding provided by the Ford Foundation

1178
01:26:16,460 --> 01:26:21,020
American Experience is also made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting

1179
01:26:21,660 --> 01:26:26,300
And by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you thank you