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Hello, this is Elsa and today I have with me Robert who has utterly amazing

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evidence. By that I mean he's not going to talk about theory, he's not going to

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conjecture. He's made observations for years and then a friend sent me a video

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and said you have got to see this and so I did and yes lots of evidence

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because what Robert did is he went to one California fire after another and

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took photos not his ideas about things not his speculations. What you're going

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to see is what he saw and that by the way is something incredibly important.

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What evidence do we have? So welcome Robert and I am delighted to be talking

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with you. Well howdy, good afternoon Elsa and I'm glad to be on your show. And then

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we talked a little and you know that I always like to know not just what's the

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evidence but who are you? How did you get to be that way? You are not the only

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citizen of California, you're not the only person who backpacks or hikes and

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yet you're the only person who did this. So could we go back like in childhood

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were you already very observant or what were you like as a child and how did

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that develop? I'd have to say my mom and dad would take us camping a lot and I

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fell in love with the outdoors. It was just so alive so I started learning the

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fauna and flora probably in the late 60s little by little. So that would be

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my beginning mostly my dad he was taking us camping and then in high school I

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had a two-hour horticulture class and an hour of forestry so I had three hours of

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plants and it was very simple for me I liked it already. The next year the

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sophomore year the teacher had me come back and be his assistant if you will at

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16 years old three more hours of that and around that time at 15 16 years old I

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started backpacking and mountain climbing kind of a younger age and

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wherever I went I was carrying scientific plant books cooking on the

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campfires all the way up to 12,000 feet and that's what I usually do I have

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stoves but it was nice to have a campfire so somewhere around high school

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I learned almost every tree in California and a good 4,000 plants

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before I even turned 18 and that's 48 years ago I've been studying plants my

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entire adult life at a scientific level in the field and at home and I've turned

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into a professional botanist and a certified arborist for 20 years and then

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I let that lapse because I didn't want to do their zoom meetings on computers I

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like to go in person to these arborist seminars we have to acquire points to

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remain being an arborist and I just didn't care about that part of it

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anymore because the same time I was starting to forensically analyze all

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these fire aftermaths and how did that start by the way why did you do that how

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did how did that happen like well in my first photograph when I bring that up I

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can explain that about the same time should I bring those up right now okay

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but how did you get started you do hear of the fire or did you oh no and see it

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how no no I was researching a hiking area up around Santa Rosa north of me

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less than a hundred miles because I hike all over the whole state and I was just

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gonna do some day hikes or something and on the computer screen comes up a

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picture of Santa Rosa from the air looking down and all I see is the houses

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are just missing their white ash and I see all the trees are left and that

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didn't work too well for me I dug into it more and more and I couldn't find

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anything on this talked to my two brothers about it and they said you need

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to go up there so I went up there two months later and analyzed the whole area

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and nothing was normal when I drove around walked around talked to people

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nothing was normal and I still didn't have a clue what was going on something

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I'd never seen in my life so I started what normal would be what would you

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expect normal then show a little about the abnormal stuff you found okay

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normal is your forest is burned up the leaves are the first thing that burns

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all your needles on pines and leaves on other trees they burn up they're gone

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the twigs and branches burn right behind those especially if it's a hotter fire

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or a or a firestorm which we've been having these firestorms where the winds

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moving up to 60 or you know 60 miles an hour or perhaps even more when it gets

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to those winds there's not much less left standing and the first to go is the

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trees but that didn't happen the trees were all there dead and dried out some

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brown some light shade of green but not necessarily burned up and that's just

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didn't compute to me so for a year and a half I'm scrambling on the computer

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trying to find anybody that's seen what I've seen and I couldn't find anybody

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even the YouTube all the videos were more of Forest Service and Cal Fire and

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I don't know what you were seeing was obvious I mean like you're the only

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person who noticed dear me the trees are there and the branches are there I mean

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everyone was seeing it and nobody was registering or nobody was photographing

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yeah and then I finally found the YouTube video of John Lord and Matt

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Deakin the two fire captains both 30-year fire captains on YouTube five of

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these videos I watched all five and they saw what I saw so that I was elated and

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I didn't know I could leave a message on YouTube which I did and they got back to

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me after that magic happened we got together and discussed it and they're

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good friends of mine now and sadly John passed away two years ago he became a

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dear friend but Matt and I are still great friends and we go for hikes

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several times a year okay now let's see some of the stuff you saw that you would

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not have expected to see okay now I've got a photograph on here can you see

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that you're gonna have to do share screen push go to the bottom and one of

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your options is share screen okay let me find that share screen it's green I'm

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sorry share screen there it is share okay now I bring my photographs in can

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you see that okay yes I see a photograph I see a photograph of bunch of white lots

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and a lot of trees in between is this the first shot you saw this is I believe

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there was two shots this is one of the two and I saw this and all I see is

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green trees everywhere up and down every street between houses why would they be

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green between houses and the cows are not even partially burned they're

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completely gone white ash with metals left and it really didn't compute to me

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when I saw this it took me a good year and a half to figure out this whole

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game if you will were you taking photos during that year and a half oh yeah I

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went up there and I probably had two cameras with me and I took many

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photographs of another area near nearby here I spent all day all day up there

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I've been up there five or six times now all the same areas and new areas and

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I talked to a lot of people and ask them a lot of questions and here's the same

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area just a different view I believe but the same thing and up in this valley in

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Santa Rosa you know there's a good ten native trees that grow in this valley

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but we've introduced another 70 perhaps from all over the world and many of them

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are flammable combustible leaves or needles from pines and eucalyptus and

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California Bay tree trees that burn quick in a fire first things that burn

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especially the eucalyptus and I'm not seeing that in the picture there's too

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much green and hard to call this a forest fire when the forest didn't burn

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and the same year I believe it was same year 2017 the Paradise Fire went off and

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they took away 15,000 homes or they call it structures including shacks and barns

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and sheds and whatever else but 15,000 and I saw this picture this is a little

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bit higher in altitude where they can get a couple feet of snow so you're not

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going to have the subtropical trees like eucalyptus so these are almost all

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conifers the number one tree in this picture is the Ponderosa pine which is

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the number one pine tree in all of California and happens to be the tree

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that burns more often than any other species in California the picture here

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is full of them there's also some white fir incense cedar some Sierra redwoods

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some imported Italian cypress in a row which kind of burned to your left and

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some many others I think some cedars from the Himalayas in Africa things that

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take the cold blue spruce probably also but I see houses missing and here's the

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forest pretty intact a little light green but I can't say they're burned up

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same thing nothing black really just white ash and if a house gets that hot

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you would think there'd be nothing left of the forest also I mean the forest

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didn't catch the houses on fire hard to buy fire insurance to protect yourself

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from a forest fire when the fire or the forest didn't burn that's also paradise

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looking down somebody else's picture any of these aerial shots are not mine

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somebody else took them perhaps a helicopter or one of these little drones

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I'm not sure which here's another one with oh probably 60 foot Ponderosa pine

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mostly they're there they're dead but they're not burned up and the houses are

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just missing why do you mean they're dead explain they're light green and

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when a needle turns too much light green it lacks the nutrients inside it's dying

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out like any kind of tree or bush if they're too light in color they've

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dried out they've gone past the point of coming back and that's not all trees

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you know some will sucker back but not this one if they're light green that's

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it they're dying and I did go up there three years later I had I went there

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after the fire three years later and analyzed it and hardly any trees were

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standing so this is what I find all over this one's a little bit blurry this

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is somebody else's again from Santa Rosa California the jack-in-the-box on the

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left which they didn't rebuild at the tops of McDonald's and the gas stations

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on the right all three buildings are made of nice construction they're not

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all wood houses like some of our houses are built this is a nicer materials more

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flame or fire retardant types of building you know terracotta and metals

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and plastics and steel aluminum yet here they are just a pile of scrap metal and

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oddly enough the three trees here which happen to be related to your poison oak

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is Peruvian pepper which we call California pepper here Chinese pistachio

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a type of pistachio and African sumac and none of those were burned up the

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only trees in the picture at the far top of the screen just out of the picture I

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noticed there was a willow tree I'm not sure what species it was dead not a

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leaf on it it wasn't black but it was dead and the ground was black all around

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it the willow tree holds probably the most water for its size than any other

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tree on the planet willow family is very an extreme water lover that tree

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was dead and at that point I didn't know why a willow would be dead and this is

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a very low lying area there's creeks around it and a willow tree you'd have

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to rob it of its water to kill it which would but here's this thing dead in the

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ground black so that was kind of odd and I will get to that shortly any questions so far no I am

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seeing a lot of destroyed buildings and I am seeing things that look like forest at this point

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they leaves look dry but yeah the twigs the needles everything they're all there that's right

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this is up north in Redding California up near Lake Shasta and this was called the Fawn fire

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this was a two-story house and this is what's left just just gone on the left you have a black oak a

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digger pine a deodarse cedar the skinny one it's from the Himalayas some ponderosa pine in there

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and maybe a blue oak or canyon oak they're all dead or they appear to be dead but they didn't

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burn and look at the house look what happened to the house oddly or not there was a lady up

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here backpacking and they put she was standing around somewhere and they made up a story and

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they put her in jail that's happening all around California at least at least five or six different

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aftermaths I've analyzed that had this type of burn pattern they put people in jail and blame it

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on them none of these people could have in their wildest dreams started this type of fire they're

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not scientists which that really gets under my skin putting people in jail that have nothing to

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do with this they're just at the wrong place at the wrong time this one is on the western side of

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Yosemite National Park a town called Mariposa just east of it there was a giant fire last year so

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this isn't even a year old these were these were mobile homes this is all that's left the mobile

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home all your trees are dead some of those trunks that are burned up happen to be really

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close to the house those are the only trees I'll see burned when they're in very close proximity

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to houses which have a lot of metal in them the rest of the forest just looks dead but not burned

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up and same place oh same picture maybe very close I guess two and a half years ago something like

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that we had our largest fire in California was called the Dixie fire somewhere around a million

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acres burned up up north in a town called Greenville which this is it's near the volcano

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Mount Lassen and I saw some pictures on the internet so I did a road trip spent a day here walked the

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whole city the main body of the city it all looks like this just metals but more than anything the

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forest itself I noticed it's all dead but it's not burned up what kind of wildfire doesn't burn

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the forest up we can't really call it a forest fire can we this is everywhere I go on highway 395

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eastern Sierra Nevada you see snow in the background this is close to topaz lake

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a town called Walker on the Walker river system and the pine on your left is a pinyon pine those

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are the pinyon pine nuts that we eat the pinyon pine is our commercial nut that pine tree didn't

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burn and this is somebody's garage just filled with metal equipment they were a metal worker of

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some sort all your metals are left the building's gone and this pine's right over it it did not

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burn up it tried to a little bit but it wouldn't ignite and that's kind of goofy the tree on the

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right we're going to talk about later that's called a Fremont Cottonwood we'll talk about that

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shortly this is up in Greenville again look like a little strip mall of two or three stores they're

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just gone and here's the forest behind them Black Oaks Ponderosa pine dead but not burned nope

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so well back to that one it's a better view possibly back to Walker a pinyon pine is one of

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the more flammable pines anything that's high desert or inner coast ranges of California where

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summer temperatures can go over 100 degrees those tend to be a more flammable or combustible needle

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opposed to the fog-loving coastal Monterey pines and some of your

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mid-coniferous forest pines like ponderosa and sugar so forth and these didn't burn up

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this is probably highway 89 going from Mount Lassen to Lake Tahoe that Dixie fire also the

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whole forest is dead the trunks are black and here there's plenty of needles right down by the ground

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a forest fire up high or down even if it was a ground fire it would have ignited these trees

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down at the lower needles and it didn't and nobody else was talking about this except these two

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captains I mean that's right and I had to teach both Matt and John the trees with all their years

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of experience they knew a few trees but nothing you know not nearly enough for fire captains they

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should really know a lot of trees that burn up I was amazed at that I came up with an idea why

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these tree trunks are black because there's not appendages hanging off of them and tiny little

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limbs or needles why are they black so high up your main growth layer your cambium layer is

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just inside the bark and that's where your nutrients and water which is sap on pines

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moves the fastest and it's kind of a conduit if you will and whatever this technology is

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it likes to it likes the water loving trees and the liquidy saps so I have a feeling

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that these blackened areas are from the cambial fluids that go up and down the tree

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and somehow it ignites them kind of like an electrical circuit completing its circuit

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I'll probably talk more about that later on here I remember from the video that I was sent that you

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have some amazing photos of the insides of trees yeah the outside is amazing in one way as in

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way as in they shouldn't be here but the inside is super amazing um here's your young ponderosa

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pine and folks want to tell me that well the fire didn't get up in the crown well it did if you

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watched the youtube videos on the internet from other people there's flames everywhere ground

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trees well here they are right off the ground and needles have been falling you see under the pines

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needles have been falling like crazy why didn't this cluster of babies burn up if it was a ground

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fire and somebody even tried to tell me ponderosa pine is fire retardant I think they need to read

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a book and actually get out there and experience it same thing here this is east of auburn on

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highway 80 the main freeway that goes over to north shore lake tahoe and reno just east of auburn

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uh I believe this is called the mosquito fire uh anomalies everywhere even where the

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needles fell off some of the pines the twigs didn't burn either and here's a baby one the

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grounds black around it nope it didn't want to burn that day something I've never seen um

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perhaps almost three years ago now we had forest fires if you will all around the san francisco

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bay area every single side of the bay area burned up and I don't know how many houses I have a list

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of houses burned in the last decade but I'll share that on a future video this is north of

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the bay area the nappa area vacaville and all the way to calistoga and the lake in the background

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is lake barriessa this fire was gargantuan they said it was multiple fires that joined together

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burned the whole area um well over a million acres here's a digger pine uh spring has come

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you see the grass starting to grow probably february but a little tiny pine like this did

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not burn up I've seen many of these digger pines in the inner coast range and sierra foothills

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all burned up just from normal fires here if the grounds on fire why didn't the needles burn

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this is one of my most damning photographs the same year approximately three years ago

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when they burned the whole bay area uh we have a redwood park all redwood trees down in big basin

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it's called on the san francisco peninsula they took the whole park away for two years they close

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it down here I'm standing on the ocean highway highway one looking east at this eucalyptus

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grove these are the most combustible leaves I know of and maybe there's perhaps another one

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that's worse but this tree I can light on fire with a cigarette lighter a green leaf take it out

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of my pocket and light the leaves on fire and they'll burn the whole grove down as you can see

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the ground's black everywhere there's plenty of leaves touching the ground or in very close

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the forest I saw them in different areas same scenario this is two or three months later

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uh February or March we're starting to get green grass and not all the trees regenerated

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you see one near the middle of the picture with green suckers coming off the bottom that's

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generally what they do whether it's been burned or not or they're not in the same area but they

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are in the same area and they're not in the same area and they're not in the same area and they

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do whether it's been burned or cut down a eucalyptus will regenerate from a stump not all

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the time but many times they will grow back that's not happening I noticed with the eucalyptus I've

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found around California and there's your forest if you look hard all the trunks are black in there

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but yet the leaves the most flammable part of the tree they didn't want to burn

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another one that's in the pine family a douglas fir this is a baby douglas fir perhaps three feet

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tall it's the second tallest tree in the world happens to be the king of the pine family douglas

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fir it didn't burn up ground's black there's a house to the left that's just missing and here's

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the most flammable thing that didn't ignite if you've ever burned an old Christmas tree right

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after Christmas and I don't recommend it in your fireplace sometimes it's a douglas fir like this

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you wouldn't believe what it will do in a fireplace it's not something you want to do

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now this is way up north again the fawn fire where the ladies in jail these happen to be

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eucalyptus again way up there the trunks have a little black they top them because they need

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wire clearance above but yet they didn't combust again all the leaves are intact to this day

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any fire I've gone to with eucalyptus leaves I've not seen one leaf burn to this day and the other

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tree that is like that is this one oh I'm sorry this eucalyptus also they didn't burn

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these are even falling off the tree because they're dead this next tree here is a California bay

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California bays in the Laurel family with avocados and campers and the noble bay of commerce

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that we put in our spaghetti this leaf you can light on fire with a cigarette lighter another one

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many times I've backpacked in the coast ranges of California and it's late at night and I can't see

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my tent I'll pull these leaves off of a tree and put them in my little tiny tiny campfire and

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and in an instant I can see the whole area and find my tent they're very combustible these leaves

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to this day I've not seen a bay leaf burn they dry out they turn brown even if they turn black

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they won't burn up this one yeah the other road going to Lake Tahoe is highway 50 over

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echo summit up there is you're almost in the subalpine belt all conifers but there is still

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some willows these are a small species of willow that might perhaps grow to six feet high

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and extreme water levers there was water all around here this is even mud and the fire we

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had a couple years back burned the ground the trunks and into the root system of the willows

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um this is almost impossible you'd really have to put a lot of firewood here

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and duff and needles to burn and to get it to look like this these are extreme they hold so

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much water uh I don't even know how this could have even happened these are little these are

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only one inch diameter uh trunks that come up um there was a walnut orchard these are

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english walnuts that are I'm not sure if they're grafted these are english walnuts down near

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vacaville California where they had that giant lake barriers at fire I don't remember the name

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of this fire but it went from highway 80 all the way to calistoga burned all the ranges this is a

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whole orchard of these walnuts they were in a perfect row and as you can see in the background

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there's no combustible materials here the ground has been eaten up by either cattle or they till

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it with uh you know tractors and stuff how in the heck could this walnut burn from the inside out

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and fall over like this to me it looks like lightning hit it right there a direct hit

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all the walnuts were like this or they were even worse and the leaves are still on them

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walnut also carries a ton of water a lot of your hardwoods do if there's a

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drought tolerant some of the drought tolerant trees actually hold a ton of water

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in their trunks and branches

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this is north of Santa Rosa which I find this everywhere if a tree is next to the road and it

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it was in the fire footprint and it burned up if it's hanging over the road you want to cut it down

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because of safety well I see the stumps and here they are burned from the inside out

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this is either a California bay or a coast live oak it's one of the two

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this can happen with large large trees they can have cavities of course but these are young trees

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and you're not going to get a fire on the inside there's no cavity where it could have got in there

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and especially burned down and people turn around here with their vehicles there's soil

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compaction here where even the weeds don't want to grow because there's no oxygen in the soil

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roots have to breathe and when you drive cars and vehicles around trees it pretty much compacts the

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soil and starves the tree of oxygen and it'll slowly kill a tree over time that's why in parks

283
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they put little cute fences around these giant trees to protect them from soil compaction

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so here a fire did not get in the ground and come up through the roots like it would way out in the

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deep forest somewhere so it's almost impossible to burn it from the inside out this is another

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one they were all in a line from the inside out where there's no updraft in there at all

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and I'm finding it everywhere the trees are burned internally and at the trunks at the lower trunks

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right where the ground is this is I believe a blue oak in the mariposa area

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another very damning photograph this is the Kincaid fire north of Santa Rosa on a back road

290
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this is 130 foot blue gum eucalyptus in my 33 years of tree work I've never seen a cavity

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even a small cavity you know a hole inside of a eucalyptus tree it fell over from the fire

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not one leaf burned but the trunk laying there at seven feet tall that's how giant it is and a whole

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middle burned out and there's this little metal post here these t-posts they pound in the ground

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to keep cattling one of those posts is behind the stump pretty much touching it and I started

295
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thinking how hot did that metal post get to make this gargantuan cavity and what I tell people

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about the photograph is this is cattle country it's September there's nothing to eat in the

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hills the grass the grass is gone it's down to a half inch the combustible materials is virtually

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gone the hay truck has to show up to feed the cattle or they'll starve so on the ground with

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hardly any grass how could it possibly do this kind of damage there's not enough combustible

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materials any questions on that or any other photos it's very very obvious what I'm seeing

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it doesn't tell me how it doesn't tell me who that you couldn't photograph but it does tell me

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what it tells me a lot about what now this

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like I stated before the hardwoods and drought tolerant trees sometimes they'll hold an immense

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amount of water this is out of mariposa the oak fire again near Yosemite this is a madrone tree

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holds a ton of water I've cut them down for a living madrone tree happens to be in the family

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with blueberries and cranberries huckleberries and also manzanita which is super drought tolerant

307
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but it holds a ton of water so here's this tree with a lot of water in it what the heck happened

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there was even water below it in the creek which didn't stop it was a perennial creek

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the forest was dead again I saw a lot of trees like this just burned internally and

310
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there was never enough combustible materials underneath of it you see the granite rock

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underneath the granite rock isn't even black near impossible but yet it happened

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this is a tree from the internet this is not my photo some type of cypress I believe nothing's

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on fire anywhere except the tree lightning strikes happen especially at higher altitudes

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but this doesn't have that signature usually it puts a stripe down the tree top the bottom goes

315
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from the top of the tree all the way to the ground splits it wide open in different ways

316
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but doesn't get on the inside and stay there this is really something I've never seen this is another

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one which isn't my photograph either kind of blurry I just wanted to show those something I've

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never seen now this is something I have a lot to talk about the upper limbs look like aspen trees

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they're directly related populous is the genus of cottonwoods which are in the willow family also

320
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I believe this is the largest water holding capacity tree in the whole western U.S. a

321
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:18,840
Fremont cottonwood can be six feet or 15 feet in diameter there's some really large ones

322
00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:24,920
they're extreme water lovers that have to be right next to a creek spring river or lake

323
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this one is along the walker river eastern California there this is all river rock all

324
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these rocks have been moved around over centuries from the river changing course they're all rounded

325
00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:45,640
and beat up and there's nothing here that's even flammable dirt and rocks and yet this tree burns

326
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:49,800
internally and the whole bottom and down into the ground into the wet soil

327
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,960
this should be dead last of any tree to burn

328
00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:04,520
it would take an amazing amount of days to burn through it like it like it has you'd have to stack

329
00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:10,440
firewood and just keep feeding the firewood day after day to get this type of burn pattern

330
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:15,800
you're just not going to get through a Fremont cottonwood back to the wall that orchard

331
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,360
burned the bottom with nothing around it

332
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,360
yeah and the leaves there's the leaves they're dead but they're not burned

333
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:33,160
here's another water holding capacity tree like your fig tree this is a mulberry they share the

334
00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:40,760
same family and have white juice instead of a clear sap or juice these have a sappy white juice

335
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a mulberry tree holds a ton of this it has so much liquid in it any cut and water sometimes

336
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:54,680
will spurt out of it and yet here it is out in the delta in a place called Ielton where

337
00:35:55,160 --> 00:36:03,400
Ielton where 21 mobile homes were taken away they just turned into scrap metal yet I couldn't find

338
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:09,880
the grasses burned like behind it the grasses didn't burn there was eucalyptus there they

339
00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:15,000
didn't burn just the mulberries the ones that held the most water and some of the mulberries

340
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:21,240
were in a lawn grass everywhere a lot of water out in the delta I don't know what could do this

341
00:36:21,240 --> 00:36:26,920
even lightning it doesn't have this type of look it burned internally the bark came off of it

342
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:34,680
unbelievable this is a picture I had to put in here I put three of these in here

343
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hopefully everybody will understand this as a tree grows

344
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:48,040
it's when it's growing it's creating sapwood live tissue where it's sappy the whole inside

345
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of the tree is sappy it's live as it ages it'll collect heartwood that's the middle that's dry

346
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and dead that's hard and it's non-conductive tissue has no more sap flowing in it that portion of the

347
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tree is dead in the middle and it's called heartwood these are the two tallest trees on the planet

348
00:37:07,240 --> 00:37:13,400
coast redwood and douglas fir first and second tallest these are babies when it comes to these

349
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:20,200
two trees your coast redwood can grow at least to 15 feet wide the douglas fir eight foot wide

350
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:26,520
why is there so much heartwood in these little tiny babies they're acting like an old old tree

351
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:33,000
with that much heartwood the reason they were all cooked from the inside out that's what I believe

352
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:38,600
and whether it was fast or slow I cannot tell but I've never seen anything like this and I cut down

353
00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:45,160
redwood trees all the time with the same diameters they do not have heartwood at this huge proportion

354
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:47,000
any questions about that

355
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:59,880
no questions nope not a single question okay same thing here these are black oaks up in the sierra

356
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:05,640
you're at 90 percent heartwood the sapwood's keeping the tree alive is just an inch

357
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:10,840
so it's acting like a really really old tree and these are not that old

358
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:16,680
another pile these are douglas fir in the concave fire area oh no I'm sorry

359
00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:22,360
they're douglas fir and redwood again if you look close the heartwood is 80 or 90 percent

360
00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:29,800
that doesn't happen and but yet there they are now that's enough of trees right now we're going to

361
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:40,280
get into materials and I'll start with tires out of 200 tires I see they're usually missing

362
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:46,440
they're just completely melted and they look like this there's a pile of slinky like steel belts

363
00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:53,240
and there's no rubber to be found I dig around in there and the rubber's just gone then I see this

364
00:38:53,880 --> 00:39:00,200
one out of 200 tires completely unaffected and I turn it over make sure nobody just

365
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,840
rolls it there and set it down and there's a you know an imprint of the wheel on the ground it's

366
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:11,080
been sitting right through the fire perhaps a couple years but it's not melted and I see that

367
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:17,400
on the label polyester cord now I hear there is one steel cord in there around the bead that holds

368
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:25,480
it on so I guess there is at least one bead but not like these that's the way I find them

369
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:31,640
one or the other either the tire is completely missing with steel belts in a pile or the rubber's

370
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:39,800
not touched at all and it has that on the print I never knew a regular forest fire cared about

371
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:46,920
metals inside of a tire so that's the tires I probably won't get back to them

372
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I'm finding this on the fences whether it's cattle country or just around homes I'm finding

373
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fences whether they're painted or not they're mostly burning at the ground level and where

374
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:07,880
the nails screws bolts or hinges affix the cross boards to the post but the fire's not climbing

375
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:13,720
normally and just burning from the bottom to the top it's skipping wood it's only burning where

376
00:40:13,720 --> 00:40:20,280
the nails are this incidentally is where the ladies in jail up north I'm sure this evidence

377
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:28,760
isn't in isn't in the courtroom wish I was there over at the oak fire by Yosemite there's a nail

378
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:34,520
in each burn spot here they were falling out as they moved it around trying to get a better picture

379
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:41,080
just shocking when I see that fire doesn't do that it burns the wood and drops the nails on the

380
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:46,680
ground same piece I'm trying to get a better contrast picture you see three of the nails there

381
00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:55,640
yes the fawn fire up north again fire doesn't do that it climbs the post if anything it might

382
00:40:55,640 --> 00:41:02,440
leave the very top it does not skip the wood between my girlfriend found found this one

383
00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:07,880
over by big basin there's private property all the way around the perimeter of the park

384
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:14,600
and the fire was its footprint was larger than the park here's the nails the only place this post burn

385
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:21,560
and your media giants will tell you it's the flying embers I've heard that so many times

386
00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:28,280
I can't stand it the flying embers well I didn't know flying embers were attracted to metals

387
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:34,520
flying embers were attracted to metals that's a new one on me so I'll go through these a little

388
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:39,640
bit quicker the post because I have probably 20 pictures of the post but I find these at every

389
00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:46,920
aftermath different types of wood perhaps douglas fir redwood pine it doesn't matter what they all

390
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:55,320
look the same the the most burned area is where the nails or other hardware is fixed to the post

391
00:41:55,320 --> 00:42:03,080
post even barbed wire if there's enough barbed wire coiled up around a main support post or a

392
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:15,400
corner post it'll burn up there but not between yeah that's a split rail fence made of cedar

393
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:24,120
either incense cedar or red cedar from the coast this is a rainy day often I take off a day of work

394
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:31,080
in the rain and I'll go assess one of these fires that's not too far away same burn patterns

395
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:37,880
this is a wooden guard rail in a community called port costa it's across the straits

396
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:43,960
where all our California rivers come together at Benicia California just across the street is this

397
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:49,240
grove of eucalyptus that didn't burn up but they're all dead and here's their little regional park

398
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:56,680
um guardrail made of wood the only place it burned is where the screws are that's one

399
00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:03,880
there's another one all the way down the road and then the fire goes out it sure likes those screws

400
00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:12,920
besides the middle post here you see nails at each big indent looks like a bite mark

401
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:20,280
you see nails in there not sure what that one was I'm finding this a lot fire climbs up the wood

402
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:25,560
and doesn't lap around the corner and burn the rest of the wood and of course there's that

403
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:31,560
metal post so it pretty much heated up that post and burned only that side of the wood

404
00:43:33,240 --> 00:43:38,280
this is a parking block and today I grabbed all the pictures of this block so there's four or

405
00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:44,360
five in a row this is perhaps 30 feet long along the ground where people pull their car up next

406
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:49,560
to it to block their wheels so it doesn't roll down down the hill there's nothing flammable in

407
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:54,920
this area you see the rock behind it and behind me is dirt where the cars would be yet the bolts

408
00:43:54,920 --> 00:44:02,120
were on fire each one same rocks different bolts just basically where the bolts are

409
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:04,760
so

410
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:07,640
amazing

411
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:17,720
and that was the calpella fire by ukiah california on highway 101 where a vagrant or poor person

412
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:24,040
homeless person was watching the fire from a bridge he just stand there watching the fire

413
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:31,640
they put him in jail and said he did it that's doubtful and there's of course a big screw at

414
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:36,120
the top going through the post all the nails in the middle and the barbed wire this is five

415
00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:40,120
feet off the ground down low the fires didn't lap up against the post

416
00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:46,680
this was an old bridge on sonora pass road the original

417
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:52,360
bridge for highway 108 at dardanelle the fire came and for some reason they felt like they

418
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:57,480
had to take the old bridge and get rid of every part of it no matter what evidence I call it

419
00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:01,480
they didn't get this and most of the burn was where the bolts were again

420
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:09,640
they burned up a huge amount of the forest up in dardanelle this is your greenville or dixie fire

421
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:14,520
again most of the burn on this old wagon wheel where's where the attachments where all these

422
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:22,680
nails were right in the middle of the wood so I will finish up with these posts here I think

423
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:30,520
we'll get into some other materials any questions about this no extremely extremely clear

424
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:38,680
any questions I might have had you answered nails and bolts highly formidable doesn't matter if the

425
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:44,840
post whatever the wood it's made out of this one's pressure treated doesn't matter this is what's

426
00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:51,720
happening the hardware or metals are burning and the wood is only burning as an after effect

427
00:45:51,720 --> 00:45:58,760
because of close proximity that was the markley bill fire and the mountains

428
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:04,920
on the other side of hope valley the carson road highway 88 a giant fire that took away some houses

429
00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:12,040
but burned a huge amount of acreage there was anomalies everywhere same thing here

430
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:20,840
pines in the background burned a little bit but not burned up loving those bolts a screw

431
00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:28,120
two screws a little metal fitting and then the fire went out guard rails there

432
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:33,880
the guard rails are burning where the bolts are these are a big what are they 10 foot

433
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:40,680
10 inch square wood that goes in the ground that supports your guard rail they all look like this

434
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:46,680
this was just my best picture they'll be burned at the ground and up where the bolt is and when

435
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:51,400
you see a guard rail you usually don't see anything around them they're in gravel cement

436
00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:57,480
side of the road dirt there's no brush stacked against them no combustible materials so i don't

437
00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:02,920
know how it would even burn up the ground or around the bolt and what i'm noticing since i

438
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:10,840
start looking at these is they're replacing them with this this is statewide they're putting in a

439
00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:17,640
plastic the black thing is a plastic bushing of sorts and i don't know what the metal in the back

440
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:22,600
is it looks like aluminum but perhaps it's some galvanized thing so i don't think these are going

441
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:28,680
to burn up in the next fires everywhere in the state i see this county city state property

442
00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:35,000
federal property national parks this is what they're doing kind of a coincidence that they're

443
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:36,040
changing all these out

444
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:45,880
john matt talked to me about the paradise fire and that as soon as the fire is out they quickly

445
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:51,080
come in there the road crews and pull out your culvert pipes that go underneath the road now a

446
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:56,680
normal wood fire or forest fire doesn't have anything to do with these pipes that are you know

447
00:47:56,680 --> 00:48:02,840
deep under the road and they're metals yet only where the fire across the road they're pulling

448
00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:11,400
these out these 11 or 12 were pulled out on carson pass road near caples lake almost the sub

449
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:17,240
alpine forest up there where it's rare very rare to see a forest fire the fire went up there across

450
00:48:17,240 --> 00:48:23,560
the road in the 12 or 11 pipes they pulled out and put in cement like this or a giant plastic

451
00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:31,960
pipe not metal anymore now why would they change them in the fire area we've never seen anything

452
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:37,880
like it here's one of them you can see it's almost sub alpine there's aspen tree here lodge

453
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:46,280
pole pine and some old sierra junipers you're up 8 000 feet now and it's rare to have a fire but

454
00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:55,080
yet one was up there i'm starting to find this there's really a lot of information here this is

455
00:48:55,080 --> 00:49:00,760
the mount hamilton fire i do not know what they called it but it burned most of the mountain

456
00:49:00,760 --> 00:49:07,800
range between livermore california and pacheco pass that's north and south and san jose and tracy

457
00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:12,680
california out in central valley almost the entire range they burned it up and burned a lot

458
00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:19,480
of houses i think that one was somewhere around 1500 homes and here's these metal tea posts that

459
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:26,120
are hammered in the ground to keep cattle in and then whatever else this is springtime the fire's

460
00:49:26,120 --> 00:49:31,400
gone spring came and went by the looks of these weeds and stuff this is may or june

461
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:39,480
the ground did not sprout no grasses no weeds no subterranean roots came up you know bulbs

462
00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:46,680
corns rhizomes rootstocks none of them regenerated zero it sterilized the soil

463
00:49:47,880 --> 00:49:54,440
now that's unheard of even if you cover the soil up with plastic and let it go a whole year the

464
00:49:54,440 --> 00:50:00,120
minute you take that tarp off and it rains sprouts come up everywhere seeds lie dormant

465
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:05,880
especially subterranean root root structures it didn't happen here i started thinking how hot

466
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:13,720
could this post have gotten i don't know that same year two and a half years ago almost three

467
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:20,680
there was a fire at lake sonoma a newer reservoir maybe 30 years old up to the west of highway 101

468
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:28,040
i just call it the sonoma lake fire i did some analyzing up there for another whole day

469
00:50:28,040 --> 00:50:34,760
here's a pickup truck in the back window melted out onto all these items here to melt that glass

470
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:44,680
it starts melting at 2500 degrees a forest fire a regular wood fire we know of tops out at 1427

471
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:49,160
it can't get to the temperatures to melt those windows unless you're using an accelerant

472
00:50:51,320 --> 00:50:57,240
my true fire camp captains told me about that they've you know 30 years each 60 combined years

473
00:50:57,240 --> 00:51:02,680
they've never seen a window on any vehicle melt they might be shattered or broken but they're

474
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:08,120
never melted out and here's the back of the truck with all the rubber tires gone and you see the

475
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:13,960
steel belts everywhere what is that plastic chainsaw doing there it's a little bit black

476
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:19,800
trying to melt but it should be completely gone with these heats and it didn't happen and nobody

477
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:25,880
just stuck it there i'm sure it was sitting there plastic should have melted out it didn't happen

478
00:51:28,360 --> 00:51:31,080
and here's that fremont cottonwood i just put this in my

479
00:51:31,880 --> 00:51:40,200
group here this was a four foot diameter fremont cottonwood the fire burned the heck out of it

480
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:46,040
internally it fell over all the leaves are on it you see them everywhere there was a spring here

481
00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:50,920
i knew i had there had to be a water source for this big tree to grow an extreme water lover

482
00:51:51,640 --> 00:51:58,200
and nothing burned but the trunk internally and at ground level any questions on that

483
00:52:00,280 --> 00:52:07,800
nope i thought i was done with trees but that was one uh out of order this is what i find

484
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:17,320
your tires they all look the same unless it's a polyester cord sitting out in the field if that

485
00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:22,440
if the polyester cord is on the vehicle with all the metal that rubber will be burned up but if it's

486
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:30,280
sitting out in the field it will not be touched uh i'm trying to think of the location here

487
00:52:30,280 --> 00:52:39,160
uh this is the um weed california uh just let last year they had one they called it the mill

488
00:52:39,160 --> 00:52:46,200
fire because the milk the lumber mill caught on fire just the roof i saw a picture and then it

489
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:51,880
burned the rest of the building uh killed a couple people up there very sad burned down lots of

490
00:52:51,880 --> 00:52:59,960
houses and here's the car with the aluminum rim melted out to melt the aluminum rim it's 1221

491
00:52:59,960 --> 00:53:06,200
degrees forest fire doesn't get up there well it gets hotter than that but that's up in the trees

492
00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:10,840
where there's combustible materials at ground level you could never get those temperatures

493
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:18,760
to melt the whole rim also i noticed when hoods are open the aluminum i believe intake manifold

494
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:27,080
on some of these engines that's melted out um the two fire captains i i asked them a lot of questions

495
00:53:27,080 --> 00:53:31,960
over the years they told me a grass fire at ground level just an inch off the grass or the

496
00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:37,800
off the ground your temperatures are around 300 degrees that's just your smallest of fires

497
00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:46,360
um nearly impossible to melt an aluminum rim and i've found some rims out in the middle of the dirt

498
00:53:46,360 --> 00:53:53,160
away from vehicles they melted into a puddle and that can't happen not at ground level with just grass

499
00:53:54,120 --> 00:54:01,160
uh i'll see this sometimes and i think this is aluminum and their alloys where they make a lot of

500
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:07,400
alloy type rims so it's not pure aluminum i call it chunking out it's my own term they'll come out

501
00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:13,640
in pieces like this on the brittle side another one they just kind of chunk out oddly

502
00:54:15,160 --> 00:54:20,280
uh i can't expand on that too much there's your windows that's the way they all look

503
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:27,480
there's your windows that's the way they all look every window in every vehicle 106 trips to 38

504
00:54:27,480 --> 00:54:34,440
after mass every window no exception they're all melted and the two fire captains told me they've

505
00:54:34,440 --> 00:54:40,600
never seen a window melt out even when they got a fire call that a car was on fire and they got to

506
00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:45,160
the fire late in the day because they were so busy with other emergencies and the fire was basically

507
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:52,920
out they'd never seen a car window melt out 30 years each so that was uh an eye opener

508
00:54:54,040 --> 00:54:58,520
this is the way they all look and in the background black oaks with their leaves

509
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:11,080
this is my friend's vehicle he had a car lot out in the hills beyond livermore california in this

510
00:55:11,080 --> 00:55:18,120
area there's basically three two trees the blue oaks and digger pines and they're all far apart

511
00:55:18,120 --> 00:55:25,320
and it's only a grassland yet 25 of his old 60s cars here rivieres and other ones all of them

512
00:55:25,320 --> 00:55:31,080
were toasted like this this was his commute vehicle back and forth but all the other cars

513
00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:37,800
were completely toasted all the windows everything and this is a dirt flat with zero combustibilities

514
00:55:38,600 --> 00:55:40,760
um or combustible materials

515
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:49,400
back to greenville california the rims chunked out some melted a little bit the windows

516
00:55:52,600 --> 00:55:57,240
weed california again with a mulberry tree next to it or a sycamore another high water

517
00:55:57,240 --> 00:56:04,040
holding capacity tree and the one behind it i believe is a silver maple same things the water

518
00:56:04,040 --> 00:56:09,560
holding capacity trees are first to burn and the back looks like a cedar i believe it's a cedar

519
00:56:10,120 --> 00:56:11,240
didn't burn all that much

520
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:18,120
house is gone windows are gone and here's the pine needles this is a digger pine tree

521
00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:22,840
to my right didn't want to burn and the needles turned black which i've never seen

522
00:56:22,840 --> 00:56:23,960
but didn't want to combust

523
00:56:26,840 --> 00:56:31,080
you can see this is months later all the needles have fallen off the tree the grounds black with

524
00:56:31,560 --> 00:56:40,280
needles and so the needles didn't burn and look at these cars as dr judy wood would say they're toasted

525
00:56:43,080 --> 00:56:49,080
a fire truck in greenville i hope they escaped it how'd that catch on fire away from the trees

526
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:55,240
the trees were black but the twigs did not burn this is already this might be a year later

527
00:56:55,240 --> 00:56:57,400
here wow

528
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:05,640
the oak i'm sorry the mosquito fire out of auburn whole forest is dead but i can't say it's burned up

529
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:16,360
this is out in ielton the mobile home park where 21 mobile homes were

530
00:57:17,320 --> 00:57:27,000
burned up this is the wood steps to go up into the mobile home the only wood on the property didn't burn

531
00:57:31,560 --> 00:57:37,480
the cal pellifier again where they put the homeless man in jail this is the house that's

532
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:42,600
missing a mobile home again behind it are bay trees the tall straight ones are bay trees

533
00:57:42,600 --> 00:57:48,360
they're very flammable trees they didn't burn that day and they're right behind the house

534
00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:54,520
the mill fire again up by mount shasta

535
00:57:56,760 --> 00:58:02,120
the the trees are spread out far and wide somehow they all turn brown and the house is missing

536
00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:10,600
so this goes on and on every aftermath looks the same that's the one in reading again looking

537
00:58:10,600 --> 00:58:14,760
farther out a sea of dead trees but not burned up

538
00:58:18,280 --> 00:58:25,880
very very telling it's an absolute mess of evidence yeah this here's your truck windows out again

539
00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:32,520
all the leaves are there and another thing i find besides mobile homes mobile homes are first to go

540
00:58:34,520 --> 00:58:40,040
and those are generally poorer people perhaps retired moved to the country with a fixed income

541
00:58:40,040 --> 00:58:45,720
all their money is involved in their property in their little mobile home and they take those

542
00:58:45,720 --> 00:58:52,600
away first almost every fire has a mobile home park with many of these what i'm finding a lot

543
00:58:52,600 --> 00:58:57,240
is trampolines now yes that one could have melted a little bit but i'm finding a lot of them with

544
00:58:57,240 --> 00:59:02,680
just a few holes in them now there's some type of synthetic and rubberized and i'm not seeing them

545
00:59:02,680 --> 00:59:08,840
all melted up and gone i mean the house is gone and there's plastic toys there with it but i'm

546
00:59:08,840 --> 00:59:16,040
finding a lot of trampolines and here's another deck to those mobile homes now that's the door

547
00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:21,800
frame to go inside the mobile home you walk up the steps open the door and walk in why is the

548
00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:28,360
wood not black at least on that side where the fire was that's the wood shows you we're dealing

549
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:33,080
with a different type of flame this is not your wood combustion flame that we know of unless that

550
00:59:33,080 --> 00:59:40,120
wood would have been gone first that's your number one flammable material instead it's the metals

551
00:59:41,880 --> 00:59:47,960
up in calistoga i found a lot of evidence at one house this is by a vineyard the house is missing

552
00:59:47,960 --> 00:59:54,120
here's a partial bag of soil it melted a little bit but this is the thinnest bag you can get

553
00:59:54,840 --> 01:00:00:01,160
it should be long gone it didn't go anywhere this was nearby a synthetic cushion to sit on

554
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:06,440
there's a tennis shoe well maybe the tennis shoes farther on there was a lot of stuff there

555
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:14,760
this is the big basin area again house is missing a plastic swimming pool some tarps all this

556
01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:21,320
plastic stuff not a hole in it whether it had water in or not there'd be some melting somewhere

557
01:00:21,320 --> 01:00:27,000
along the top i'm not finding it all the redwood trees in the back they're black the needles are

558
01:00:27,640 --> 01:00:33,800
on them again well the needles burn first in any fire same spot the house is to the left now gone

559
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:38,840
here's a canopy we put your table there is a table in there i don't think the canopy was made of

560
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:49,080
asbestos not one hole um this is something i'm finding out lately is if i get to the fire

561
01:00:49,080 --> 01:00:56,680
aftermath quick enough i'll see piles of plastic all lined up and ready to be taken away from the

562
01:00:56,680 --> 01:01:03,880
properties all the different types of materials here they're taking them off the properties before

563
01:01:03,880 --> 01:01:09,640
they let you back in and they say well it's not safe enough for you to go back yet so i believe

564
01:01:09,640 --> 01:01:15,000
there's trucks coming in hauling off everything off your property that didn't burn or maybe some

565
01:01:15,000 --> 01:01:19,640
of it did i think they tell them to just clear the properties of all materials because i'll find the

566
01:01:19,640 --> 01:01:26,200
properties devoid of everything but if i get there quick enough this is what i find the things that

567
01:01:26,200 --> 01:01:34,840
didn't want to burn wood plastics start scratching my head plastics little toys

568
01:01:36,600 --> 01:01:41,080
another swimming pool at greenville i believe there's a metal part down there in that pool

569
01:01:41,080 --> 01:01:48,360
filter but the rest of it didn't really burn up or melt and i don't know how many homes

570
01:01:48,360 --> 01:01:56,680
burned in this town this is the same yard there was a wall a brick wall or a stone wall where you

571
01:01:56,680 --> 01:02:00,120
couldn't see over it if you were in a vehicle driving by you couldn't see over it to see these

572
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:05,400
plastics unless they would have taken them now there is some melting on them but they should be

573
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:11,800
puddles of plastic on the ground this was a firestorm the only plastics i found all day was in

574
01:02:11,800 --> 01:02:18,680
this one yard and i was there most of the day walking around the whole city black soil

575
01:02:21,480 --> 01:02:28,200
a swing set in the caldor fire there are metals supports and chains and i don't know why this

576
01:02:28,200 --> 01:02:36,120
didn't melt the slide all the plastics so some of the metals won't ignite and i don't know if

577
01:02:36,200 --> 01:02:43,240
that's because they're galvanized or plated or what that's not my area but everywhere trees

578
01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:49,400
were burned and they put a caution tape up to stay off this dangerous kids play toys

579
01:02:50,200 --> 01:02:55,240
so the fire was there and this isn't a brand new swing set i looked at thoroughly it's been sitting

580
01:02:55,240 --> 01:03:00,840
there there's the tennis shoe in calistoga a synthetic grounds black just didn't want to burn

581
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:06,760
another pile that they forgot to take away it was out of view of the road behind a container

582
01:03:06,760 --> 01:03:12,120
freight they made the pile but then somebody didn't put it in the truck and take it away

583
01:03:12,680 --> 01:03:18,840
you see plastic pots there for for little plants the blue and pink rubber hoses the black pipe

584
01:03:18,840 --> 01:03:24,680
across the top is plastic that's plastic the chair is plastic and there's metals in there too and

585
01:03:24,680 --> 01:03:29,000
there's metals in there too and why would they do that why would they steal your stuff

586
01:03:30,200 --> 01:03:35,320
i'm finding that more and more a tow strap right in the middle of something that burned up

587
01:03:35,960 --> 01:03:43,640
tow strap should be gone a synthetic garden hoses oddly it burned where it's connected to the

588
01:03:44,200 --> 01:03:48,280
the water spout that's metal which is black down there but the rest of the hose is kind of okay

589
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:56,920
okay the materials are always left behind now that's all i've got for this section

590
01:03:57,960 --> 01:04:03,720
that's all my photos i think 120 or something like that i finished on a nice happy note of a

591
01:04:03,720 --> 01:04:15,960
mountain lake so um any questions well i think there are many questions but what you have given

592
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:21,800
us is evidence and from the evidence we can go and you know i don't even know if that lake is

593
01:04:21,800 --> 01:04:27,560
happy uh you know was the lake boiled like everything else this is a beautiful pristine

594
01:04:27,560 --> 01:04:33,080
wilderness okay this lake was not damaged this lake was not destroyed no it's just one of my

595
01:04:33,960 --> 01:04:38,440
new backpacking areas it's very nice snow melt snow melt will have that look to it

596
01:04:38,920 --> 01:04:47,160
pristine waters almost pure h20 yeah i've been to glacial waters and they are this amazing

597
01:04:47,880 --> 01:04:49,000
bluey green color

598
01:04:52,120 --> 01:04:54,920
why don't you stop the record and we will talk a little bit

599
01:04:56,040 --> 01:05:06,360
upshare okay okay um well it's really really interesting evidence for everyone to look at

600
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:12,520
as much as it's interesting i find it quite something that most people

601
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:21,320
haven't come to your kind of conclusion because it doesn't seem that you are like

602
01:05:21,880 --> 01:05:28,680
sherlock holmes it doesn't seem that you are seeing clues that aren't there i mean those

603
01:05:28,680 --> 01:05:33,880
plastic i mean those homes that were missing with the trees that were standing anyone could see

604
01:05:33,880 --> 01:05:42,280
that and anyone could go this is not the way fires work fires work always like you know they

605
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:49,080
on on the flammable stuff um the one thing that comes to my mind i'm pretty sure it's come to

606
01:05:49,080 --> 01:05:56,920
yours is that you can't put metal in a microwave oven but you can put plastic in and keep it there

607
01:05:57,560 --> 01:06:01,480
water will boil quickly in the microwave

608
01:06:03,880 --> 01:06:10,040
other things will heat too but you definitely cannot put any metal in if you just remembering

609
01:06:10,040 --> 01:06:18,840
i put in a without thinking a cup which had a you know 24 karat gold like a little old special cup

610
01:06:18,840 --> 01:06:23,000
i was just going to read the tea and i hadn't thought of that was anything special

611
01:06:23,000 --> 01:06:28,200
and all of a sudden i was getting sparks all over my microwave that it was like you know

612
01:06:31,160 --> 01:06:35,160
so i'm sure that you've had that kind of thought have you had any other thoughts

613
01:06:35,720 --> 01:06:41,640
clearly i have one thought and that is the government if the government if the government

614
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:48,120
has nothing to do with it then i'm astounded that no one from the government has gone look at this

615
01:06:48,120 --> 01:06:55,800
like seeing the same some nefarious it's the russians or the chinese or somebody is doing this

616
01:06:55,800 --> 01:07:03,480
like this is not a migrant this is not a homeless person who is destroying homes 15 000 homes and

617
01:07:03,480 --> 01:07:11,560
leaving the trees standing i mean there's a couple there's a couple things i like to add to that

618
01:07:11,560 --> 01:07:18,200
i'd love it i've gone as far as i can anybody that studied any kind of fires you know they

619
01:07:18,200 --> 01:07:26,440
need the three equal components to have a fire your wind your heat and your fuel well these

620
01:07:26,440 --> 01:07:31,960
are always hot days they seem to generally they're a hot day and incredible winds that i've never

621
01:07:31,960 --> 01:07:41,560
seen in my life but the flammable materials the fuel is not burning instead of wood it's metal

622
01:07:41,560 --> 01:07:49,640
the fuel is metal we can see from my photos so that mixes up messes up the wood of combustible

623
01:07:49,640 --> 01:07:57,160
materials because they are not burning also a couple quotes i'm not sure who the first one is

624
01:07:57,160 --> 01:08:07,240
from it's it starts like this any any significantly advanced technology is

625
01:08:07,240 --> 01:08:13,640
indistinguishable from magic it's kind of like our cell phones if those were invented in the 70s

626
01:08:14,440 --> 01:08:20,280
that would be like magic that's what's going on right now this is so far beyond us we can hardly

627
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:26,920
can hardly comprehend what's going on and tesla himself years ago i don't know the year

628
01:08:27,880 --> 01:08:34,360
he wrote on a plaque he will live to see man-made horrors beyond your comprehension

629
01:08:35,080 --> 01:08:41,480
and that's what's going on right now also a third one is what our president said in the 80s in the

630
01:08:41,480 --> 01:08:48,360
early 80s we had a president that got on national tv and he says we're developing our star wars

631
01:08:48,360 --> 01:08:54,200
defense system we laughed at that when i was in our 20s and i'm not laughing anymore

632
01:08:54,200 --> 01:09:01,080
i don't know where this technology comes from i don't know who's doing it i can't point the

633
01:09:01,080 --> 01:09:08,200
finger because i have no idea all i can do is examine the materials and with my background of

634
01:09:08,200 --> 01:09:14,280
backpacking a good 10 000 miles and climbing 130 mountains cooking on the fire for a virtually a

635
01:09:14,280 --> 01:09:21,560
lifetime and an analyzing forest from sea level to 12 000 feet i've never seen this in my wildest

636
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:27,640
dreams so it really is very blatant to me it stands out like a sore thumb

637
01:09:30,200 --> 01:09:41,000
absolutely it really does stand out um i really you know this is something i would say incredible

638
01:09:41,400 --> 01:09:42,440
um

639
01:09:44,360 --> 01:09:52,040
i thank you for showing all this and thank you for being yourself because you're not as i've

640
01:09:52,040 --> 01:09:59,240
already said the only backpacker you're not the only hiker you've also spoken of this you told me

641
01:09:59,240 --> 01:10:05,480
to your friends for years and instead of going wow you're really onto something their response

642
01:10:05,480 --> 01:10:11,560
was quite different if you would let me know like you know how people responded i mean what

643
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:18,600
you're telling me it's obvious look at this post it's the nails that burn well you know that if

644
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:24,840
you put a big nail in a let's say wood stove and the wood will burn and in the end when you sift

645
01:10:24,840 --> 01:10:33,000
through the ash the nail is still there that's right well seven years i've been doing this now

646
01:10:33,880 --> 01:10:40,040
because it's just so blatant and i had to find out what's behind it um maybe one or two friends

647
01:10:40,040 --> 01:10:45,240
out of all my friends and i really have a lot of friends that's the way i am uh maybe one or two

648
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:51,000
of them get it and both of them are backpackers which i've taken them on many excursions out for

649
01:10:51,000 --> 01:10:58,280
weeks uh the rest even the four arborists i know they think i'm crazy nutty they make fun of me

650
01:10:58,280 --> 01:11:04,040
they have zero background of like mine they might be book smart to a degree and became an arborist

651
01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:09,320
and then all their college courses which i have not myself stepped in the door of any college

652
01:11:09,320 --> 01:11:16,440
i've just had my head in a book for 48 years hands on whether it's wildflowers ferns shrubs vines or

653
01:11:16,440 --> 01:11:24,040
trees i'm versed in almost everything that grows wild in california um so i've hit a brick wall

654
01:11:24,040 --> 01:11:31,000
with almost everybody i know and i've moved on to people that are on the fence people that want

655
01:11:31,000 --> 01:11:39,640
to learn some many people do know what's going on there's just other people that are more in line

656
01:11:39,640 --> 01:11:49,480
with me i think that now you have just made this huge move because when you spoke to i forget her

657
01:11:49,480 --> 01:11:55,000
name was peggie i believe the first day hall peggie hall when you spoke to peggie hall she

658
01:11:55,000 --> 01:12:02,040
was on your wavelength she knew what you were talking about and then somebody that i know

659
01:12:02,760 --> 01:12:09,640
watched it and went oh i need to send this to elsa and probably some other people in other words

660
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:14,360
it was all like-minded people who suddenly were getting it and then i contacted you because i went

661
01:12:14,520 --> 01:12:18,520
this is really interesting stuff like you i don't know who did it

662
01:12:19,720 --> 01:12:29,400
i don't know why it was done except it certainly this is not a pro-human thing it is not for people

663
01:12:29,960 --> 01:12:33,960
i mean i believe you mentioned that the trailer parks in other words poorer people were most

664
01:12:33,960 --> 01:12:40,120
damaged other people might have insurance but it really was not encouraging people to live in this

665
01:12:40,120 --> 01:12:50,280
beautiful wilderness area and then it's massively destructive of wilderness area too i mean there is

666
01:12:50,280 --> 01:13:00,040
huge acreage that has been destroyed this way by unnatural fires yes so anyway i believe that now

667
01:13:01,080 --> 01:13:05,960
i'm very grateful that somebody like-minded saw your stuff like peggie hall and that other

668
01:13:06,040 --> 01:13:11,080
saw your stuff like peggie hall and that other like-minded people are seeing it because all

669
01:13:11,080 --> 01:13:17,400
these years we would have appreciated your stuff and i am so grateful finally your stuff is getting

670
01:13:17,400 --> 01:13:23,720
out into the world do you have any last words for people stuff you would like people to know or

671
01:13:23,720 --> 01:13:31,720
think about or anything yeah just a few i use this term vigilant i hope folks can stay vigilant

672
01:13:31,720 --> 01:13:36,120
when they know there's a fire and it's almost out i'd like people to go out there take all the

673
01:13:36,120 --> 01:13:43,480
pictures they can share them with people observe trucks going in and out of these places see if

674
01:13:43,480 --> 01:13:48,520
they go in empty and see if they come out with materials maybe be on top of a little tiny hill

675
01:13:48,520 --> 01:13:53,960
nearby where you can see inside the top of the trucks and take pictures see what they're taking

676
01:13:53,960 --> 01:13:59,880
off your property take note of that and your garbage cans i didn't bring that up your plastic

677
01:13:59,960 --> 01:14:05,560
recycle garbage cans those are not melting unless they're next to metal also and those are being

678
01:14:05,560 --> 01:14:12,520
taken away garbage cans everywhere paradise was full of plastic garbage cans they didn't melt

679
01:14:12,520 --> 01:14:16,280
thousands of them so somebody took them away i don't know if it's the company themselves that

680
01:14:16,280 --> 01:14:23,160
has the garbage service and then they're all replaced and a lady i met online she actually

681
01:14:23,160 --> 01:14:28,760
went to paradise with her group and saved all the cats and dogs that were strays in the town

682
01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:32,840
many of them were burned up in lots of ways and they the goodness of their heart that helped all

683
01:14:32,840 --> 01:14:39,560
these animals and everybody was against me that day on one of these websites and she said wait a

684
01:14:39,560 --> 01:14:45,240
minute he's right she went there to save these animals and all she saw was plastic garbage cans

685
01:14:45,240 --> 01:14:52,440
everywhere and 15 000 homes are gone so that's another thing stay vigilant keep your eyes open

686
01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:55,400
take all the photos you can ask questions

687
01:14:57,880 --> 01:15:03,720
another is going on the roadsides where there's turnouts to see if there's any litter in the

688
01:15:03,720 --> 01:15:08,680
forest where the fire has been all the plastic water bottles should be melted things like that

689
01:15:08,680 --> 01:15:14,760
rubber tires see what condition they're in follow the creeks if there's any nearby see look for the

690
01:15:14,760 --> 01:15:18,840
extreme water lovers and see what happened to them that would be the willow and cottonwood

691
01:15:19,560 --> 01:15:25,240
any area is going to have those species the next family is the birch and alders right now in canada

692
01:15:25,880 --> 01:15:30,840
the white birch of the east coast that's the extreme water lover in that area and there's

693
01:15:30,840 --> 01:15:37,400
probably an alder but take note of the water loving trees and what's happened to them take

694
01:15:37,400 --> 01:15:45,560
pictures of that and just stay awake share your information get out there in droves of people and

695
01:15:45,560 --> 01:15:51,720
and find out what's going on here instead of and the biggest thing is turning off your tv

696
01:15:52,840 --> 01:15:59,320
the tv is basically the enemy it's the biggest brainwashing tool ever created you'll get the

697
01:15:59,320 --> 01:16:03,560
truth if you go out there yourself and do the footwork bring friends with you bring different

698
01:16:03,560 --> 01:16:11,240
eyes so everybody can see what's going on that's about all i can say that's really good i like it

699
01:16:11,320 --> 01:16:16,920
that you said perceive see look for yourself because what happens with the television or

700
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:22,600
with cell phone because now a lot of the time people get all their messages and their emails

701
01:16:22,600 --> 01:16:28,520
and the news and everything from cell phones is you don't perceive you are told so you're told

702
01:16:28,520 --> 01:16:33,880
and you believe i believe i believe which is totally not what you're doing you are going

703
01:16:34,040 --> 01:16:38,040
to

704
01:16:38,040 --> 01:16:45,960
tell me if i touch things what do i get so you're using your senses as opposed to that the only

705
01:16:45,960 --> 01:16:53,960
sense that you use on the television is your hearing but the hearing has often nothing at all

706
01:16:53,960 --> 01:16:59,160
to do with the evidence so i love what you say thank you very much and do you have any last last

707
01:16:59,160 --> 01:17:01,000
words so i'm not the last person talking

708
01:17:04,760 --> 01:17:09,720
yeah we got to take care of this planet and all the wild places and all the wild animals

709
01:17:10,520 --> 01:17:18,120
plants trees everything and if we don't wake up and educate everybody about this

710
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:25,080
our natural areas are going to go away they really will and right now it's at an alarming rate this

711
01:17:25,080 --> 01:17:29,960
is happening on the whole planet i didn't talk about all the other countries i've analyzed

712
01:17:29,960 --> 01:17:35,480
from the internet many other fires around the planet same thing give some some countries that

713
01:17:35,480 --> 01:17:40,280
like did you look at australia which countries have you looked at australia with the eucalyptus

714
01:17:40,280 --> 01:17:48,520
fort mcmurray canada gattlingberg tennessee greece portugal all southern california all those fires

715
01:17:48,520 --> 01:17:56,600
i've seen them and the parking structure in liverpool england the parking structure where

716
01:17:56,600 --> 01:18:04,280
1100 or 1400 cars got toasted and it's all pure cement there different levels a china car factory

717
01:18:04,280 --> 01:18:09,560
same thing you'll find that one on the internet i'm not sure which other ones those are the ones

718
01:18:09,560 --> 01:18:16,680
that are on the internet and you find all the same things anomalies everywhere that do not add up

719
01:18:16,840 --> 01:18:22,840
thank you for connecting that to those other places because it's really good to know this

720
01:18:22,840 --> 01:18:29,640
is not just happening in california and that you have turned your eyes again your senses you

721
01:18:29,640 --> 01:18:35,000
didn't go to Greece yourself but i'm sure you looked at pictures you got the evidence and

722
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:43,400
you're not listening to what you're told you're listening to your eyes that's right i'm reminded

723
01:18:43,480 --> 01:18:48,040
that's right i'm reminded of judy wood and she was talking about 9 11 and she said

724
01:18:48,600 --> 01:18:55,720
i didn't listen when i look my ears go off i don't hear things i just see things

725
01:18:56,600 --> 01:19:01,560
i think that what you're saying is something so really vital and i think this is in everything

726
01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:09,400
and it's also also on the tv or radio when you hear their experts their fire chief their

727
01:19:09,960 --> 01:19:16,760
cal fire representative their biologist trying to explain to us how and why this happened it's one

728
01:19:16,760 --> 01:19:22,280
of two categories they're either downright lying or they're very ignorant of what's going on i

729
01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:29,080
don't know which but they are my fire come on with fire i have you know you have a campfire

730
01:19:29,720 --> 01:19:36,360
and you know wood burns and one of the things i know that is if you put let's say some old

731
01:19:36,360 --> 01:19:44,360
logs that have nails in them in a campfire the log burns and the nail stays all the log burns

732
01:19:44,360 --> 01:19:50,280
the entire log burns that's right and and it doesn't and the the nail doesn't make it burn

733
01:19:50,280 --> 01:19:55,880
more or less it's just that's right it's just doesn't get hot enough that's right to damage

734
01:19:55,880 --> 01:20:01,560
the nail you could do that a million times you get the same result i don't have to do the

735
01:20:01,560 --> 01:20:07,880
experiment i hope people want me to do these experiments i don't need to you've got the

736
01:20:07,880 --> 01:20:14,040
evidence and that's what you've given and i really appreciate how meticulous you've been going around

737
01:20:14,040 --> 01:20:20,040
getting evidence accumulating evidence so that it's all there and thank you for this time

738
01:20:20,920 --> 01:20:26,440
i didn't feel rushed at all i went through every category i could think of and expanded on all of

739
01:20:26,440 --> 01:20:32,600
it so this is probably my best interview all right thank you it's a pleasure and it was a

740
01:20:32,600 --> 01:20:37,400
pleasure listening to you listening to the incredible wealth of information you had

741
01:20:39,160 --> 01:20:46,680
and this is going to go online and if people want they can go and write to me and i can

742
01:20:46,680 --> 01:20:55,240
get them in contact with you and it will be a pleasure and i know that you've been contacted

743
01:20:55,240 --> 01:21:04,360
by you told me mr red pill expo himself i was i was amazed i don't know this gentleman i've

744
01:21:04,360 --> 01:21:14,040
not read the book and he calls me up okay he is like-minded he could see how valuable your stuff

745
01:21:14,040 --> 01:21:23,400
was and so that is a tremendous pleasure so i will let you go now with a thank you and goodbye okay

746
01:21:23,400 --> 01:21:29,000
take care you too